Murcielago vs C6 Z06 vs Skyline vs Impreza....

Discussion in 'Videos and Sounds' started by PandaBeat, Oct 10, 2006.

  1. #51 Mack100, Oct 13, 2006
    Last edited by a moderator: Apr 25, 2016
    Audi can build a clutch that lasts for 300km.The problem is Renault,Peugeot or Lancia can also do that.SO Audi tries to make their clutch smaller and lighter.You know what I want to say...

    Watch these videos.

    .

    Kubica and Alonso(the drivers in the videos)were excellent karting drivers.If there's something karting teaches you,it's to be very agressive at all time.And guess what?you have to be even more agressive in wet conditions.And that's what they did.
    I don't think I need to tell you that the fastest drivers in the world all began their careers by driving karts.

    Theory and practice are completly different things.
     
  2. "If WR didn't heel and toe in a 300km rally I think he might get some problems with it"
    Dude, Audi (and other companies) can get clutches that last much longer than that for dry-pavement road races. Are you seriously trying to make the case that WR used heel and toe *ONLY* to prolong the life of the clutch? On the basis of what?

    And those videos didn't prove anything. You can still be smooth *and* drive fast/aggressively in the wet. The two aren't mutually exclusive.
    Refute what I said, instead of offering up irrelevant videos.

    Still can't tell me why the importance of smoothness in the wet also translates (to a lesser degree) to smoothness in the dry? Can you cite a single reputable source that says abrupt gear changes, ragged weight shifting, improper engine/road speed matching, etc should NOT be minimized for best lap times?

    Also, back on Prost, apparently in his instructional book, he advises heel & toeing with the heel on the brake, with the toe working the gas (opposite of the convention). It's quite possible he simply wasn't comfortable with heel & toeing. Some drivers might find its next to impossible to do in the confines of a tight race car.
     
  3. "You can still be smooth *and* drive fast/aggressively in the wet."
    Now that's awesome.

     
  4. Not as awesome as you failing to refute anything I've said...speaking of which, when are you getting around to doing that?
     
  5. I'm just impressed by your huge knowledge you have about performance driving.You must be a pro.I'm realizing I was doing everything wrong all these years.


     
  6. Answer: NEVER.

    Goodbye.
     
  7. ^^^^What are you argueing about?
     
  8. i would put all my money into the skyline, if it had a good driver. hands down.
     
  9. You idiots, all of them use heel-and-toe except the guy in the Murcielago (Daisuke Ito), simply because he is driving a semi-auto car, it isn't suposed to heel and toe in a 2-pedal car! Stupid discussion!
     
  10. If you don't heel toe when you are on the limit under braking you will get compression lock up.
     
  11. #61 Mack100, Oct 16, 2006
    Last edited by a moderator: Apr 25, 2016


    Panizzi's left foot wasn't on the brake pedal just to look cool.

    I know Guibo is going to say that this doesn't prove anything and that he could have been a lot faster if he heel and toed.Guibo,I don't think you are going to tell Gilles Panizzi how to drive.
    I never said that the heel and toe technique makes you slower.All I'm trying to say is that there are hundreds of things that are more important than how to shift down and that there's a huge gap between theory and practice.
     
  12. #62 Guibo, Oct 16, 2006
    Last edited by a moderator: Apr 25, 2016
    I don't have to tell Gilles Panizzi how to drive, anymore than you can tell any number of drivers who do employ heel & toe how to drive. Like I said, some drivers might not use it simply because it's not comfortable to do. There are also some who don't practice it because their race cars don't facilitate it (the semi-auto gearboxes in some race cars may blip the throttle to match revs, thereby doing exactly what would otherwise occur in a heel & toe maneuver).
    And yes, again, that proves nothing other than some Japanese racers who can lap just about as quick as one of the world's top rally drivers (and they didn't understeer off the course either).

    You've brought up squat to refute my point: that smoothness can lead to not only more control but ultimately quicker lap times. Any reputable high performance driving course will tell you that more often than not, smooth driving will allow you to lap faster than abrupt. And there are very sound fundamental reasons why. You can't figure it out, because you can't figure out what makes a heel & toe downshift safer in the wet. Everyone else here seems to be able to understand such simple concepts.
     
  13. "You've brought up squat to refute my point: that smoothness can lead to not only more control but ultimately quicker lap times"
    Haven't you seen the video of Alonso? I think he's a bit better than you but I'm not sure.In that video he overtook 11 cars in 3 or 4 laps.


    Guibo,you know absolutely NOTHING about driving.Your comments are so naive and so noobish it's obvious that you never were in a race or championship.And your comments about Panizzi are so unbelievably stupid and retarted...well it doesn't surprise me.


    Just one more thing:try to explain why Alonso and many other drivers drive the way they drive(very agressive,very abrupt steering mouvements).There's a very simple reason for it.I just wanna know if you know.My 12 year old cousin knows why because she drives every 2 weeks on the karting track.I presume you are a very experienced driver so that should be very easy for you to explain.
     
  14. And if you notice in the wet, he is much less abrupt than he is in the dry (only the see-sawing action of the wheel increases due to reduced grip).

    No, not many other drivers drive that way. So therefore, the rest of the field is wrong?
    Alonso, on his driving style:
    "Alonso: It is not something I realise I am doing – but it is what the telemetry shows. I think it may be a way of adapting to the car, because when I was at Minardi and when I tested for Jaguar, I didn’t drive like this. The technique allows me to control the understeer easily – I turn in later than many drivers, and do it aggressively. Once I have done that, I can just make small adjustments to the steering from the apex and find the right balance to be quick on the exit. Everybody has their style, and that is mine at the moment. But it is always changing – the car is never the same from one lap to the next, the reactions and conditions evolve all the time. Ultimately, I don’t think the style is the important thing; it is about how well you can adapt to the way the car changes all the way through the race."

    Again, this example proves nothing (and doesn't refute what I said). One particular driving style doesn't refute the logic that most people can be faster through smooth driving, rather than ragged.


    So, now tell me, why would heel & toeing provide greater safety in the wet?

    EDIT:
    Nevermind. I can't be arsed to get back into this thread. Have fun fondling yourself.
     

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