American Car Fans- READ

Discussion in '2003 Ford Mustang SVT Cobra' started by SeansVette, Sep 10, 2002.

  1. Re: American Car Fans- READ

    I can't believe it, you're still having difficulty understanding that page, what part of "Turbo ONLY" do you not understand, let's remove the "turbo" part for a second in case that's what's confusing you, now let's look at what's left: "ONLY" now what does only mean again? oh yeah, in this case it means that the turbo is the only difference from the car being a WRX without a turbo.

    And if you go to the homepage numbnuts, and search around you'll find that it specifically refers to "Turbo Only" as having no alterations done other than an increase in boost with the FACTORY TURBO.

    Yes, the vast majority of WRX's sold in North America can only do a 14.1 run (13.9 if you want to believe just one source), however being an available option upon request that still means that a S-T-O-C-K WRX can do a 12.9 sec. run, have you got that? Being such a glue victim you must find it difficult to grasp such simple concepts.

    Now, I never said that those WRX's registered on that site ARE stock (I have no way to know), I just said that it's very possible (depending on whether or not they are still covered under warranty, with what is obviously even more boost) considering that 12.9 sec. WRX (of which I talked to the owner)was still stock.

    BTW - I have far more credibility than you, all you do is spout BS all day, meanwhile I spout a little BS, a fair bit more knowledge than you (apparently), and a LOT more evidence than you, so just drop it and admit defeat, you're just going around in circles, and trying to make up sorry excuses to discredit me, it's really quite disgraceful.
     
  2. Re: American Car Fans- READ

    Well, would like to. Just getting frustrated because we're just going in circles, every time I prove something you know who attempts to discredit me.

    That's my point, the boost was easy to adjust, was adjusted before the owner laid hands on it, and it's still covered by factory warranty.

    There's no doubt the Cobra is one of the best value vs. performance cars out there, nor that it is higher performance than the WRX, never denied it, but then that's like saying the STI is higher performance than the GT, which is also a given. However I'm going to have to disagree with you about the the Cobra being the absolute best value vs. performance under $40,000, if you exclude the hardcore performance designed cars that just look really damn fast, and offer nothing else - not even more than two seats, and only include cars that have the same basic dimensions as the Mustang then there are still the STI and EVO that are both coming here later this year (which are going to be roughly the same price) and are likely going to be as fast if not faster, and they will definitely handle better, though we'll have to wait and see to know for sure.
     
  3. Re: American Car Fans- READ

    Maybe you should do a just a LITTLE research before you open your mouth....

    1. The SVT Cobra already HAS a blower...and what do I see for a time? 13.1 in the quarter? I don`t care about displacement or FI...it was a counter-argument to your statement "it cheats by using turbos"

    2. The emissions (not admissions) laws are MORE strict in Japan....check them. So by your theory, American cars should have more power because they can put out more emissions.....

    3. Yes, I remember the muscle car era (as a matter of fact, if you haven`t been paying attention, I also owned a `67 L79)....apparently you don`t. It`s best quarter is low 14`s with 350HP. Only the most expensive cars back then were remotely fast.

    4. How about Bathhurst, a common meeting place for the Japanese engines and Detroit Iron....guess who won so much (27 Races in a row over 3 years) that they finally changed the rules and disallowed the GTR because it kept handing Holden their ass.

    5. The C5 Vette is lucky to run low 13`s and is tail happy. Read any article regarding the C5 and it`ll say the same thing. The R34 (go check the Video link I posted) runs 12.9`s stock (even 12.8`s...but I`ll let the video speak for itself)

    6. The Z06 is very different from the standard C5. The best quarter I`ve seen run by a magazine is 12.5....show me a reliable link proving me wrong. All the magazines I`ve read say the factory claimed 12.4 is out of reach without some sticky tires. The R34 N1 with more HP (450) AND TORQUE (417 ft-lbs) and less weight than the Z06 has run an 11.97

    7. Viper? How about a 45k R33 GTR...completely stock parts running 7:59 on the Nordeshliefe...setting a world record...something a stock Viper STILL can`t do.

    8. C5R? How about R390.....

    9. Have you driven ANY of these cars more than 10 mins.? Even one?

    10. These are not "my" cars or "my" companies. I don`t have a lunatic`s loyalty to a vehicle....unlike you`ve gone so far as to state. Next time...try to bring some decent information to the table instead of a "freshly pulled from your hind-quarters" argument.
     
  4. Re: American Car Fans- READ

    By the way...one last time. How is the GTS a better handler than the ACR...when the ACR is a racing package FOR the GTS? As in a GTS that was lightened, suspension tweaked, and power increased?

    What`s the max tuned output of a Viper engine by the way?
     
  5. Re: American Car Fans- READ

    Um, how about the c5R vs. Real Time Racing's NSX in the Speedvision World Challenge? Both are equally modified from the factory production car, both are fairly equal in speed, yet the NSX has obviously had the upper hand in a number of the races in the championship, seeing as it wins more often, oh and look, there are 5 c5R's in comparison to 2 NSX's, I'd think the odds should be in favour of the c5R, but alas it generally loses.
     
  6. Re: American Car Fans- READ

    Wow, do you have a lot of things wrong.

    1. The new svt cobra runs low 12's all day long. 12.4 to be exact, stock. Thats means not touching one thing on the car.
    2.Emissions are more strict here, every car that comes over here has to be "modded" to meet our emission laws.
    3.True, but for back then that was very fast.
    4.Never heard of it, I'll take your word (except the holden isn't detriot muscle).
    5.The base level vette runs low 13,s all day, and it is not tial happy, it's one of the best hanlding cars in it's price range. Any car can be tail happy when driven by an idiot.
    6.No shit a lighter car with more hp and torque will run a faster quarter mile.

     
  7. Re: American Car Fans- READ

    Wrong....having studied extensively on the subject in attempting to import my own vehicle, emissions laws are more strict in Japan than here. Do some research...the information as to NOx, C02, and methane limits are available on govt sites for both countries.
    Cars coming here have to be modified due to EPA requirements of the TYPE of emissions equipment to be used. It must be registered with the EPA. Vehicles such as the Skyline which were never brought here never had their equipment blanket approved by the EPA...for this reason, each car must be modified with EPA approved equipment, and then tested. Supras have all the same emissions equipment in the US as they have in Japan....as do GTO's, RX-7's, G35's, etc, etc.
    If you check any car offered in the U.S. that's sold in Japan (ie the G35 here, Skyline V35 in Japan) the DOT and EPA stickers are already inside the car. Now why would a company spend extra money to make the vehicles U.S. compliant if all chances were they would never leave Japan? Answer: The vehicles already meet U.S. requirements and adding the sticker to the cars costs the company practically nothing while increases convenience for their customers.
    Point two. If they were not more strict, why are Vipers, the Z06, Saleen Mustangs etc NOT allowed in Japan. They can't meet emissions. Japan is different in the U.S. in that it doesn't care WHAT you have in the car to make it meet emissions...so long as it meets the requirements. Which is why I could drive my 500HP GTR on street legally. Because most of the major tuning companys (HKS, Greddy, Sard) make Catalytic converters capable of screening the extra fuel in the exhaust without siphoning power from the engine.

    On this subject....in the USCC challenge, which vehicle had MUCH better emissions than the other....the 515HP Viper, or the 510HP GTR....It wasn't the Viper!

    Again...check gov't sites regarding this issue and you will see that I am correct. If anything, Japanese imports are at a disadvantage in the U.S. as the U.S uses ass for gas. Primarily the reason U.S. versions of imports show less power than Japanese versions...they must retard the timing to match the much lower octane standard.
     
  8. #183 27GTR, Jan 22, 2003
    Last edited by a moderator: Apr 25, 2016
    Re: American Car Fans- READ

    As to these other issues....

    1. Not according to Car and Driver, Autocar, Japan New Car, Motortrend, and Road and Track. If you want to show me a reliable link (not some honkey running quarter's in his driveway with his half sister on a stopwatch) or video...okay.

    3. Yes, it was fast back then. 8secstang seems to think those cars were SO much faster than today's cars....just not true. Even the '67 L88 w/ almost six hundred HP in stock form could barely break into the 12's...mostly due to suspension setups and tire efficiency

    4. http://www.gmhightechperformance.com/features/0111gmhtp_thebest/ Holden isn't American Muscle? I've got news...the LS1 is identical in Holden....you might want to rethink this one....

    5. Yes...low 13's...slower than the GTR...as I said. I don't know if it's tail happy, but a number of reviewers, such as Consumer Reports, seem to think it's tail happy, especially on a damp road. It doesn't have NEAR the control of the Z06. 50k for a car you can drive only X months of the year doesn't sound like a good deal to me<A BORDER="0" HREF="http://www.supercars.net/emoticons.html"><IMG BORDER="0" SRC="http://speed.supercars.net/cboardhtml/emoticons/smile.gif"></A>

    6. Then why am I getting an argument as to whether the R34 N1 can outrun the Z06, GTS, or Cobra? The argument should be non-existant....
     
  9. #184 8SecStang, Jan 22, 2003
    Last edited by a moderator: Apr 25, 2016
    Re: American Car Fans- READ

    One last time and then i'm out. These are some quotes that i'm takeing seprately from every ignorent person that I find on this site that wants to be proven wrong in one way or another so.


    PasswordPlease: "That's not the only source, show me a source that shows less than 14.1 and I'll admit defeat." Talking about how a 99 svt doesn't do better then 14.1 aight here is the source then so shut the hell up please. http://www.popularmechanics.com/popmech/auto3/9907AUCTBM.html

    K see how it says 13.5 for the mustang in 99 and since you also admit to the fact that the 99 isn't as good as the 01 ("The 99' Cobra had reliability issues on it's intake parts cuz it wasn't making the correct estimated HP that it was supposed to. Ford fixed that problem. That's why you don't see a 2000 Cobra. In 01' Ford came out with another SVT Cobra." again from passwordplease. The 03 is even better then the 01 so there for I can see 03 svt breaking into some mad mid 12s, you can check out the corvettes times to high 12s shit viper was low 12s.

    I post a clip of a stock WRX running 12.91 (yes with a little more boost than normal) and that's bullshit? Please explain how. See when you admit that it takes more boost to run 12.91 then it's not really stock is it? If you add more boost then the car isn't how it was out of the factory. I couldn't care if the first thing you did before driving the car from subaru was increase the boost and say well since it hasn't left the dealership it's stock. NO IT"S NOT!!!! MORE BOOST IS MORE BOOST IT'S NOT STOCK!!!!! Maybe your mentally challanged I don't know WRX is made to run 14s any better then that is moddeing it.


    Here is some retatred bullshit that has little to do with anything exept proving that Password please is ignorent and contredicts himself
    "I may be able to arrange for one of my "expensive Ho's" to be sent to your place, but unfortunately for you you're not even going to have the privelege of of seeing me within anything that can be construed as your immediate viscinity, particularly not when you make a proposition like that." K so you admit to haveing expensive ho's right your escort service shit that's what you talking about ain't it?
    K well then lets read this quote from you

    "Actually I just threw that % up there it was an estimation, judging by what I've read, heard, and what I've seen." "BTW - I have a girlfriend, we have a very healthy relationship, she's 2 years older than me, she goes to the same college as me (majoring in Biotechnology), and her roommate used to work in an Escort service (the money made is now funding her college tuition and living costs). I've never spent anything in order to get laid" K you say you never spent anything to get laid but your sending someone your expensive hookers? Doesn't make much sence then you say you READ about heard about it and SEEN. So you read about escorts weird topic to read about unless you wanna know the number so that you can call and get laid. You also SEEN doesn't that require you to be there, um maybe paying money for those services others wise I can't understand how you can see an escort for free, i mean if you never spent money on them that is. Oh one more thing here is another quote from you from the topic of svt or m3 found of page 16 it goes something like this

    "Ooooohhh that was so low, well at least I'm going to the good, "clean" hookers rather than paying for a $5 BJ from some 12 year old heroin addict unlike some *ahem*amcnhp*ahem* so apparently seem to be. Dolt, when you can give as spectacular face as I, you don't need hookers, you have the women clawing at your door."



    There is more though..... Still from password please "Yes, the vast majority of WRX's sold in North America can only do a 14.1" That's what they are made to do 14s Stupid If i go to ford right now I can tell them that I want a mustang gt to push some 500 hp n/a. they will do the engine mods before the car comes out of the dealership if I want them too and it would still be out of factory. Does that mean a stock gt can push 500hp no they are pushing 260 hp cause that's how they are made, do you get my point. How do I know this cause i've already checked into this cause i wanted a better engine, but at the time I couldn't afford the extra money for the extra hp.

    Moveing on almost done with password please.

    "Now, I never said that those WRX's registered on that site ARE stock (I have no way to know), I just said that it's very possible (depending on whether or not they are still covered under warranty, with what is obviously even more boost) considering that 12.9 sec. WRX (of which I talked to the owner)was still stock. "

    That's right you have no way to tell if it's stock and do to the fact that we can agree that wrx is in the 14s then 12.9 isn't ****ing stock, is it? Well it's coverd under warrenty so it has to be stock.... NO it doesn't have to be stock. If I put a catback system in my car do you think all the warrenties are going to be gone? Or if I put on a body kit on my car is my engine, tranny warrenty gone? NO it can be moded and still be kept under warrenty stop acting like such a *** you've been proven wrong many times.

    There is one more quote from password please that I can't find right now but it said that wrx were stock with out turbos. WHICH I FOUND TO BE VERY ****ING FUNNY if someone knows where it is please feel free to post it, I remember saying that i'd send him a $500 check if he found a stock wrx with out a tubro from a dealership.


    Last thing from him and i'll move on to the rest of the posers on here this is from password please "BTW - I have far more credibility than you, all you do is spout BS all day, meanwhile I spout a little BS, a fair bit more knowledge than you" Roflmfao that is the funniest thing to come out of your mouth yet you have no credibility what so ever, I feel bad for the college that's going to say that they gradutated you, if you are going to college that is, something I doubt to but am not going to even bother arguing with, what you major in again how to bullshit 101?
     
  10. #185 8SecStang, Jan 22, 2003
    Last edited by a moderator: Apr 25, 2016
    Re: American Car Fans- READ

    K this guy isn't as ignorent as password please but he does like to put words into peoples mouths and isn't very smart either so again here we go.

    From Boredup32

    "and a stock Nissan Station wagon can outrun a stock SVT Cobra without using any more than 2.6L of displacement...what`s your point?"

    Um what you think that your 12.9 station wagon can beat a 03 svt? Wrong buddy. Frist lets get many things out of the way the 03 svt performes better then a c5 but not as good as the zo6. (This is also the only cobra with a blower, i have a reason for saying this and i'll bring it up later but for now just throwing out the obvious) Now the C5 in 99 did high 12s in the 1/4 mile. Now if the 03 vette is better then the 99 version, and the svt is better in the 1/4 mile test then the current vette there for the SVT will kill your stupid wagon.

    "I`ve got news...your GTs, SS`s, and Z28`s are no more for racing than Silvia`s, 180`s, or WRX`s"

    Did you belive password please when he said that wrx runs 12s? cause it doesn't it runs 14s. The silvia doesn't do much better then that, the mustang gt aren't a good muscle car and that's comeing from a guy that loves mustangs. Yet the WS6/SS and Cobra will rape the WRX, and the Sivlia by many car lenghs and don't say that they won't cause the 02 SS/WS6 run high 12s the 01 Cobra did low 13s and the 03 SVT runs mid 12s. The WRX and Silvia are a second+ behind the domestics.

    "I`m not even going to get into the 450HP N1"

    Oh but please do send us a link that states just how wonderfull your Jap crap is, I would love to see the times on that.

    I believe the comment was, there are no sub-13 second Nissan Station Wagons...not "there are no sub-13 second Nissan Station wagons in this country, or on my block, or in my driveway

    Again lets put it like this it really does matter where a car is made. I know you tried arguing it in your favor after words but I'll get to that later, in the mean time the point still stands that matching cars that can't be sent to the U.S because of emissions or what ever other reason, can't be compared to cars that are in the U.S
    It's a very legit argument actually.


    "Who cares if it has turbo? The Mustang has what...almost twice the displacement and a Supercharger... That has to be the most ridiculous argument I have heard yet! Ford had the opportunity to use twin turbo...just like anybody else."


    Remember when i said earlier that the 03 SVT is the only one with a blower. Well here it is, that SVT with a blower can kill your jap cars with out any problem, you complain about how we use more displacement. What's it matter if that V-tech of yours is so advanced that it's sopposed to make up for it? Also I was refering to 99.9 percent of american muscle which do not use a blower of any sort and still dominate. Where as every japanies car needs it in order to make anywhere more then 250hp (estimate) the NSX is about the only exeption but it's worth what about 80 grand? tell you what take a look at this site again it's for 1999 but that wasn't that long ego....
    http://www.popularmechanics.com/popmech/auto3/9907AUCTBM.html

    See how it's listed that the NSX is 88K and is slower then a WS6
    which is worth about 27K that's really sad. doesn't say a lot about your Japanies high tech engines. For the same price you can also get a viper, oh shit wait the viper is cheaper too. WOW and you would run circules around the NSX all night long.

    "...and I've got news for you...the C5 is no competition for the R34
    ...and the Z06 Vette seems underpowered compared to a 450HP 417ft-lb R34N1, that weighs almost 100 pounds less...MSRP 51k USD"

    No competition? LOL the c5 again runs 12s and r34 runs 13s unless you got proof otherwise.

    The z06 on the other hand performce almost like the viper, Where are the stats for the r34 n1 never heard of it can't be that great then.

    "Here's another kicker.....How long did it take the U.S. to even get near the performance Japan has been pumping out for the past 13 years? They didn't even have anything that could compete with the GTR until '01. Not unless you wanted to pay 80k. Open your mind. This will certainly be an interesting argument when Nissan introduces the GTR to the U.S. in a couple years. A 3.5L that will outhandle, and outrun the Viper...for 60k. Detroit better wake up and make some dedicated platforms...or they're going to get whooped."

    That is a kicker because japs haven't been doing better then domestics. Maybe if you keep compareing a twin turbo supra to a GT mustang for the last 13 years then you could be right but besides that it's dumb. Your compareing your super cars to what exactly an SS/Cobra? Even then our cars can woop your Supras ass, and your Skyline the funny thing about it is that the Supra Skyline is a jap ultimate car, while SS/Cobras are like an every day drivers car that can compete with those 2 and don't bother saying that it can't unless you wanna show me proof. SO in reality did you mean that domestics have been out doing japan for more then 13 years?

    Then you qoute me about the fact that I said domestics have been fast during the 60s till now and your ignorent coment is....

    3. Yes, it was fast back then. 8secstang seems to think those cars were SO much faster than today's cars....just not true. Even the '67 L88 w/ almost six hundred HP in stock form could barely break into the 12's...mostly due to suspension setups and tire efficienc.

    That was in 67 you dumb dumb MF. and we broke into the 12s you said it not me. Now in what 99-03 normal jap cars are trying to break into low low 13s wishing for 12s. Key word in that sentece was TRYING. NO i think todays cars are faster but it's funny that Japans cars from this era are still competing with cars we had in the 60s. We backed of and started from scratch, because of gas prices and such we dropped our hp on cars, and are again going back to them now but the point remains we pulled those times in the 60s How long has it tooken a japanies car to get to 12s? 1998? Your 12.9 second nissan wagon? lol your about 30 years to late on that.

    1. The SVT Cobra already HAS a blower...and what do I see for a time? 13.1 in the quarter? I don`t care about displacement or FI...it was a counter-argument to your statement "it cheats by using turbos" That was so not what I said but it's okay I know you can't understand most things unless explained to you very very clearly. I didn't say it cheats. I said it's sad, also a 03svt that does 13.1 isn't driven by a pro then, if it was then it's under ever worst condition that was possilbe cause people have been reaseaving mid 12s stock.

    5. The C5 Vette is lucky to run low 13`s and is tail happy. Read any article regarding the C5 and it`ll say the same thing. The R34 (go check the Video link I posted) runs 12.9`s stock (even 12.8`s...but I`ll let the video speak for itself)

    Dumb dumb dumb i'm not going to go through this again but vettes can out do that time set by your R34 plus who's to say that r34 isn't moded at all? Not going to go there either, but a z06 would crush that and so would the new c5 vettes. New being 01 02. As much as I hate vettes I can honestly say those cars would kill your skyline.

    "6. The Z06 is very different from the standard C5. The best quarter I`ve seen run by a magazine is 12.5....show me a reliable link proving me wrong. All the magazines I`ve read say the factory claimed 12.4 is out of reach without some sticky tires. The R34 N1 with more HP (450) AND TORQUE (417 ft-lbs) and less weight than the Z06 has run an 11.97"

    k I tell you what show me a link that shows a r34n1 doing 11.97 and i'll show you one where a zo6 does better then 12.5

    5. Yes...low 13's...slower than the GTR...as I said. I don't know if it's tail happy, but a number of reviewers, such as Consumer Reports, seem to think it's tail happy, especially on a damp road. It doesn't have NEAR the control of the Z06. 50k for a car you can drive only X months of the year doesn't sound like a good deal to me

    No not low 13s and not tail happy get your shit straight first.

    I don't feel like quoting your whole story on how japs have better emissions, and it's not even true. Simply put the cars that don't meat the emissions standerds don't come to the U.S since Japan knows that one of it's biggest customers is the U.S they do work with our emissions test also but not every car of theirs meets it. And if your so knowlodgeble please explain to me what about the equipment that the skyline uses that doesn't meet EPA's aprovel.
     
  11. Re: American Car Fans- READ

    Dumb dumb dumb? That`s the best you`ve got?

    C5...13`s. Ask Sean`sVette...the guy who started this thread, and owns a C5. They won`t break into 12`s stock...sorry...just won`t happen.

    Then you compare a 600HP L88 to a Nissan Station wagon? Are you a joke?

    If you had read any of my post, you might have learned something....but I don`t think you`re trying to learn....you`re just trying to argue.

    I`m not retyping the reason for the emissions work on the GTR. If you want to know, look up and read it. Of course, maybe you just aren`t educated enough to understand....especially considering your attempt at an argument.
     
  12. #187 27GTR, Jan 23, 2003
    Last edited by a moderator: Apr 25, 2016
    Re: American Car Fans- READ

    "Remember when i said earlier that the 03 SVT is the only one with a blower. Well here it is, that SVT with a blower can kill your jap cars with out any problem, you complain about how we use more displacement. What's it matter if that V-tech of yours is so advanced that it's sopposed to make up for it? Also I was refering to 99.9 percent of american muscle which do not use a blower of any sort and still dominate. Where as every japanies car needs it in order to make anywhere more then 250hp (estimate) the NSX is about the only exeption but it's worth what about 80 grand?"

    LOL....ignorance.
    99% huh?
    Let`s go through the list shall we?
    Nissan Station wagon...as shown 12.9
    SS? http://www.supercars.net/cars/1998@$Chevrolet@$Camaro%20SS%20Coupeg.html 13.9? Damn...a whole second behind!
    WS6? http://www.caranddriver.com/xp/Caranddriver/roadtests/1997/June/199706_roadtest_pontiac_firebirdtransam.xml 13.9...same as the SS...as it should be...
    Z28? Slower than the SS
    Firebird? Slower than the Firehawk
    Firehawk? http://www.caranddriver.com/xp/Caranddriver/features/2000/December/200012_feature_firehawk.xml?page=2 13.6
    Z06? http://www.supercars.net/cars/2001@$Chevrolet@$Corvette%20Z06g.html Well, there`s one...but it costs more than an N1 and is more than half a second slower....
    GT? I don`t even have to post that one...
    Cobra? As posted before 12.9...
    Viper? http://www.supercars.net/cars/1997@$Dodge@$Viper%20GTSg.html 12.9....the same.

    There...1 out of 10 was faster than the station wagon. 1...my math puts that at 10%. And that one is still slower than the R34 N1. All of these are Car and Driver and Road and Track numbers....next you`ll try to tell me they had sh*tty drivers...LOL.

    Have to have FI huh? That`s why the Nissan President makes 415HP w/ 420ft-lbs of torque with a 4.5L V8. Japanese cars use smaller displacement primarily as they are taxed based on displacement.
    By the way...Nissan made 280HP on an NA RB26DE in 1992. No turbos, 2.6L. Chevy`s Corvette Grande Sport was only making 50HP more out of an engine more than twice the size (5.7L) Or another fun fact....when the R32 GTR first debuted in 1989, the Corvette was making 240HP and had a quarter mile time of 14.6 secs....almost 2 seconds slower than the R32!

    You seem to think I`m a honda fan when I`m nothing of the sort.
    I`m not COMPLAINING you use more displacement....I`m stating fact. As per your argument, you STARTED COMPLAINING about using turbos first.

    You debate like a five year old.
     
  13. Re: American Car Fans- READ

    Boredd up you're wrong again (wow what a surprise).
    2003 SVT Mustang Cobra: 12.4 quater mile
    2002 Camaro SS :13.3 (I have seen them run a 12.9 stock though)
    2002 WS6 Firebird :13.3
    Get your facts straight boy. You're starting to get as bad as Password.
     
  14. Re: American Car Fans- READ

    I'm not wrong....Car and Driver would be wrong....check the links instead of ASSuming they came from this site. While some do, most of the times on this site come from Road and Track. I'm pretty certain a good share of them are correct. What a number of you have heard or read on some fan's website doesn't necessarily fact. A provided video of a stock GTR running 12.9 is fact. You've seen it...you can attest to it. Do we understand the burden of proof here?

    On the WS6, the site quoted is a 98...so it had 20 less HP....the 02 does have an extra 100 pounds to carry around though, and there's only a 5 ft-lb difference between the two. I find it very difficult to believe it would run a quarter in .6 secs less with 20 more HP and a 100 more lbs. I find it even more difficult to believe the power variance between the car C&D tested and the car's running 13.3 could possibly be so great as to make that difference in time. It goes directly against engineering's principles of standard deviation.

    Boy? What are you a hick? LOL Statistically (in terms of this board), I'm likely to be both older and more educated than you. Save your "boys" for the kids.

    I still haven't seen this magical 12.4 time...anywhere. Perhaps you would care to enlighten me with something substantial.

    "I have seen them run a 12.9 stock though)" ...that's great....I've seen a Fiesta run 11.7 stock. I think you get my point.
     
  15. Re: American Car Fans- READ

    I'll call you boy until you show me that you are not, you have yet to do this.
    Muscle mustangs and fast fords ran a 2001 camaro ss against the msutang bullit, and to their surprise (and many others) the camaro ss ran a super fast 12.9 seconds, stock (yes password that means it has nothing done to it). They also ran the mustang cobra (2003) to an impressive 12.4 seconds, completly stock.
    A video of a probably not stock car (this on being a gtr) is not evidince. I could show you a video of a pinto running 9's and say its stock, how could you prove the video wrong? That means nothing kid.
    Now, it's been proven time and time again that the Camaro ss, Pontiac WS6, and the 2001 mustang Cobra can run low 13's, I don't need to go over it again. Many links have been given of the past year and a half to prove this, I'm not going to find them all to show you.
    Please, don't get your diaper in a bundle kid, I can't help it your wrong.
     
  16. Re: American Car Fans- READ

    Yet again, I see no evidence..only words...wheareas I presented evidence. It appears you (like a child) can only sit back and make unbacked statements........Henceforth, your pledge name shall be "Pee-wee".<A BORDER="0" HREF="http://www.supercars.net/emoticons.html"><IMG BORDER="0" SRC="http://speed.supercars.net/cboardhtml/emoticons/smile.gif"></A>
     
  17. Re: American Car Fans- READ

    Probably not stock? Are you so biased you can`t even believe the proof in front of your face?! Watch the video. They review the engine notice the power levels, even talk about the stock Bridestones! Before they start, the driver in the GT3 notes that he should do well because the stock tires on the GT3 are stickier than the GTR`s stocks. You`re a joke! Not to mention these are time trials from Best Motoring...and they`re not even filmed in Japan...they`re in Taiwan...hence the Chinese subtitles!


    So far I`ve been ALL over your Mustang site...and here`s what I get....on the Mustang Bullit, you need to reread it. It says Camaro is building (ie EXPTECTED TO BUILD) a 12 second SS next year (allegedly 2002)...doesn`t look like it happened. It never says they raced, it never says they were suprised by it`s speed....

    ....and I see a `99 Cobra running a 13.94 quarter...Stand back from the heat!

    On the other hand...it has an article on the PRE-production model for the Cobra running a 12.67.....but then again, the pre-production model of the GTR ran a 7:59 on the Nordeschleife.... and it also says it`s pretty unstable past 155...

    I still don`t see any articles on the actual production model though....and it`s a far cry from the claimed 12.4 I say roaming around...

    ...and the Q400 doesn`t look bad, but it`s 58k (almost 15k more than an N1) and has 50HP less (and most likely less torque as well). Although it appears you can buy a stripped down model for 33, except no springs and no brake upgrades...YIKES....
     
  18. Re: American Car Fans- READ

    You really need to stop pulling figures out of your @$$ and give credit where it's due.
     
  19. Re: American Car Fans- READ

    You can`t prove me wrong....you can prove I didn`t have all the information.
    I`m not asserting there`s no way in hell the Cobra can run low 12`s stock..or that the Camaro can`t run high 12`s stock....just that I haven`t seen anything to truly make me believe otherwise. Just don`t get me started on the "Domestics underate their HP" bit. This has to be the most prevalent self-enforced idea among domestic owners. Only one vehicle I know of that was TRULY under-rated was the `67 L88.

    These cars have the HP to run the numbers....but the problem is not power....it`s traction. 4wd offers almost twice the traction at a very small fraction of the cost (in the GTR it`s so small after the car is moving it can be neglected)

    As for the article. It looks like the Camaro can hit around a 13.4 or so on average. I didn`t see anything that says they ran 12`s...only that they believed they had the power to do so (with slicks?) The GTR with "280" HP runs 12`s....so the power is there...TRACTION is the key.

    In terms of the Cobra....I see a couple 13+ runs, a 12.8+, and a 12.79 They say his mis-shifted....but then they say...."duplicated his 1.98 60-ft. This time he found all the gears and went 12.841 at 108.66" The article also talks about stiff headwinds....but a quick look at the pictures (ie smoke from the tires) makes it evident they weren`t much more than 5mph or so.

    The objectivity of the article came into play with me on their favorite line ..."these cars were severely under-rated from the factory". More likely, Ford and Chevy ensured they put their best foot forward. And about MMFF "admitting the Chevy is fast"....they can`t help the SS was faster (than GT`s that is) ...it was a fact. But...if you push your opponent to the top of the hill....you`re obviously right behind him. (I think you get my point).

    Of particular note...while the Cobra may have one a single run at 12.79 (and even a 12.6 once in a pre-production model), as difficult as it seems to do, I wouldn`t call it a mid 12 second car....but rather a high 12. One of the beautiful things about the GTR is it`s very consistant. Traction is no problem, and the engine isn`t sapped after multiple runs. If you watch the two videos posted....but of them are 12.9X....very close together...very consistant.

    In my own experience with the RB26DETT making varios dyno runs, on the second run I posted a 408AWHP...I made four more runs with the last coming out 383AWHP. Pretty good for an engine not receiving natural cooling, but rather point cooling from a couple of hurricane fans.
     
  20. What ever happened to American Muscle???

    Yeah I'm a big critic of basically every car out there and i think the 2003 Mustang Cobra leaves a lot to be desired. Frankly, I think the 99V motor is a joke. C'mon Ford!! Whatever happened to great engines such as the Boss 429, 302, the 351-C and the popular 351-W??? I think our Blue Oval friends in Detroit are jumping into the world of DOHC engines way too fast. the SN95 Mustang would have been better off with an upgraded 351-anything. Look at GM, their cars use infinite variations of the venerable 350 small block, which is the most popular and most recognizable small block in the history of automobiles. Where is our turn Ford? When are we going to get our small block. I am sick of tired of having the Mustang criticized for having such a low specific output/litre. Ford needs more powertrain development and needs to stick with what the are good at: old school American muscle. Sorry, but Ford is taking too many risks to build a car that has now just become a name amongst high school girls. Also, Ford spent way too much money on building sub-par interiors with the newfangled Mach-460 stereo system. What's up with that!? I wish the Big Three didn't waste their money on improving interiors, leaving little left for powertrain as well as suspension development. And what is with the archaic suspension anyways? Macpherson struts do not belong on our modern pony car. Where is the unequal-length double wishbone suspension that i dream of? The Mustang used to be such a great handling car; that was in the 60's. It is 2003. For shame. I love the Mustang more than anything, but the direction it is heading is obviously in the wrong one. I am pretty tired of hearing girls talk about their piss-poor V6 SN95, which is just sick. Whatever happened to the Mustang being a real sports car??? C'mon Ford. Pull yourselves out of that rut and build a real Mustang!!
     
  21. Re: American Car Fans- READ

    Say what you want, but the fact is THE 2003 COBRA IS A MID 12 SECOND CAR, PERIOD. It's best run so far is a 12.4. Believe me or not (the web sites, even the begger ones don't have all of their articles, Muscle Mustangs and Fast Fords don't have 70% of their articles on their site).
     
  22. Re: American Car Fans- READ

    The facts do NOT dictate the Cobra is a mid-12 second car....even by the tests done by the magazine YOU offered up!

    By drag racing standards your quarter time is the best that you can do that can be duplicated 3 times. By American quarter standards, the Cobra IS a high 12 running car. Actually (if you really want to get down to brass tacks) in regards to that article with a run of 12.79, 12.84, and a 13.186....It would be a 13.186....the time that was met or exceeded three times. Which would make it a low 13 second car. Some rules even allow for averaging....in that case, the Cobra would be a 12.94 for those runs (If I remembered all the times correctly)...which is actually funny, as that's what the GTR ran consecutively in those videos I posted........

    If they don't post all their articles...then perhaps in your burning desire to prove me wrong you can scan the pertinent parts in....hmmmm?

    MMFF simply reinforced my belief the Cobra is a high 12 sec car...just like the GTR The "low end" GTR that is
     
  23. Re: American Car Fans- READ

    Look, I don't really care if you believe me or not, the fact is that the svt cobra is a 12 second car, no matter what you want to believe or not. If you decide not to believe this, fine, so be it, you'll be the one person who doesn't.
    If I get a chance I'll take a picture of the article with my digital camera (my scanner does not work, so it's now in a landfill).
     
  24. Re: American Car Fans- READ

    12 second and mid 12 second are very different.....

    The GTR is a 12 second car....which appears as is the Cobra.
     
  25. Re: American Car Fans- READ

    Oh I'm sorry I didn't know I couldn't compare a car that's about 30 years old to a new japanies car because it embarreses you my bad.
     

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