Camaro MIGHT be a diesel

Discussion in 'American Cars' started by KRSONe1, Sep 18, 2006.

  1. #1 KRSONe1, Sep 18, 2006
    Last edited by a moderator: Apr 25, 2016

    GM's new diesel is powerful, efficient

    August 25, 2006

    General Motors Group Vice President Powertrain Tom Stephens announces Thursday that GM will produce a new light-duty diesel engine that will improve fuel efficiency. (JEFFREY SAUGER/General Motors)

    • GM's Duramax engine to get overhaul
    If you peered over Charlie Freese's shoulder toward the horizon Thursday, you just might have seen the future of the American muscle car. Or, at least, the powerful and fuel-efficient diesel engine Cadillac needs if it's ever going to be a major player in Europe.

    Freese had just revealed the first tantalizing information about General Motors Corp.'s 360-horsepower V8 turbodiesel, which will debut sometime after 2009 -- probably 2010 or 2011 -- in a full-size pickup. Freese is the automaker's executive director of diesel engineering.

    Details are scanty, because GM is waiting to receive patents on some of the engine's technology, but Freese promised it would meet emissions requirements in all 50 states when it goes on sale. That's a significant accomplishment. The United States will have the most stringent limits on diesel emissions in the world in 2010.

    Other automakers, primarily German brands with a century-plus history of diesel development, have said they expect to be able to meet the requirements, but they don't know how yet.

    GM's figured it out, said Freese, but it's not telling anybody until the ink dries on the last digit of the patents.

    Here's what the rest of us know now:

    • GM promises the engine will use 25% less fuel than a comparable gasoline V8.

    • GM developed the engine to match or beat the world's finest diesels on power, fuel economy, sound and vibration. That makes it what Freese calls a premium diesel, like the ones that power most luxury sedans like the Audi A8, BMW 7-series and Mercedes-Benz S-class in Germany.

    • The turbodiesel features high-pressure direct fuel injection, dual overhead cams and four valves per cylinder.

    • GM developed it for use in a variety of vehicles, not just big pickups.

    • The engine fits in several different families of GM vehicles.

    • It may be used in vehicles GM sells around the world.

    • It fits in the same engine compartment as GM's wildly successful small-block gasoline V8, which powers everything from the Chevrolet Corvette, Impala SS and Silverado full-size pickup to the Cadillac Escalade luxury SUV and Pontiac GTO muscle coupe.

    • It will be smaller than the 6.6L Duramax V8 GM already builds for heavy-duty versions of its big trucks.

    • Emissions of particulates and oxides of nitrogen will be at least 90% lower than current diesels. Carbon dioxide emissions will be 13% lower than from a comparable gasoline engine.

    "Diesels are critical to GM," Freese told me this week. "Globally, diesels are very much in demand," particularly in Europe, where they account for about 50% of new car sales, and South Korea, where 90% of SUVs roll out of the factory under diesel power. He expects diesel sales to grow in other booming markets, particularly China.

    Diesels haven't been much of a player in North America. They're used primarily for tractor-trailers, work-oriented heavy-duty pickups and agricultural and construction equipment.

    GM was a leader in diesels once, but it lost that position through inattention and eventually sold its Detroit Diesel unit, now owned by DaimlerChrysler.

    GM spent the better part of the last decade making up for those mistakes. It builds more than one million diesels a year today. Its model line stretches from a little 1.3-liter diesel that powers small cars in Europe to the 6.6-liter Duramax V8. GM builds the Duramax in Moraine, Ohio, for use in workhorse trucks like the GMC Topkick and Chevrolet Silverado HD. Moraine built about 200,000 Duramax engines last year.

    The engine will debut in a pickup because diesel's combination of power and fuel economy is especially appealing in big, heavy vehicles. Diesel engines cost more than gasoline power plants -- nobody will say exactly how much, but $1,000 to $2,000 is a reasonable estimate -- but owners get a return on their investment much quicker when a diesel is in vehicles with low fuel economy, such as pickups and SUVs.

    The new V8 will plug a gap in GM's diesel lineup between the 3.0-liter V6 it sells in European cars like the Opel Vectra and the Silverado HD pickup's stump-pulling 6.6-liter Duramax.

    GM's not saying where the new V8 will come from, but you can bet production will be somewhere in North America and it will be used in high-end vehicles.

    That's why Freese is so adamant when he calls it a premium diesel.

    "We benchmarked it against the finest diesels in the world," including the smooth and powerful ones in top luxury sedans like the Mercedes S-class and Audi A8, he said.

    "Our engine needs to be the best," Freese said. "The alternative for North American buyers is a gasoline engine. The owners of the vehicles that will use the engine have never been exposed to a diesel, so the noise and vibration need to approach the levels of gasoline engines."

    And that opens the door for diesel muscle cars and Cadillacs.

    Without a smooth and powerful diesel for cars like its STS sedan, Cadillac is doomed to remain a marginal player in Europe, brand general manager Jim Taylor told me earlier this week.

    And imagine a 2010 Chevrolet Camaro with a 360-horsepower V8 and highway fuel economy over 40 m.p.g. That's my guess on fuel economy, but it's not unreasonable. It would make the nouveau muscle car appealing to many more buyers, and give GM's corporate average fuel economy figures a boost from an unexpected corner.

    Freese told me the technologies in the V8 may be used in other engines, and I know GM's Saturn brand is looking for fuel-efficient, low-emissions diesels for some of its upcoming models.

    The pickup truck is the start, but keep your eyes on the horizon. There's more coming.

    Contact MARK PHELAN at 313-222-6731 or [email protected]

    From here:
  2. You're making me and ChevyRocks horny. Would love a Camaro diesel.
  3. yea, I bet you would in URUGUAY
  4. ...ok?
  5. <A BORDER="0" HREF=""><IMG BORDER="0" SRC="pitlane/emoticons/angry.gif"></A> the liter of 97 octane costs 1.4 AMERICAN DOLLARS. THE #$%#ING LITER.

    The liter of diesel cost 0.9 dollars. Way cheaper.
  6. ooooooooooooh, interesting...
  7. Wait a second... this also means that there's a chance of that engine making it to the Hummer H2... that'd be great.
  8. H3*
  9. *H2
  10. Definetly, that would be freakin' boss.

    Better yet, since this engine is supposed to fit in place of any LSX motor, you could transplant something like this into an older car easily. Imagine, high-performance diesel-powered hot rods...
  11. #$%#

    SOLSTICE <A BORDER="0" HREF=""><IMG BORDER="0" SRC="pitlane/emoticons/amazed.gif"></A>
  12. Somebody better do it now, because the idea is awesome.
  13. Could be cool. Plus since they're stock turbo you could probably make awesome gains over stock... Some of the newer truck T/D engines can get over well over 400HP with BPU mods IIRC. Plus for 360HP it's got to have, what high 400s or 5xx tq.
  14. That's ace. I want one.
  15. I wonder if the Camaro, if it goes diesel, will have a trailer hitch option, and pull ratings, and also optional 30" mud tires.
  16. As long as it has a shitload of torque I will welcome a diesel Camaro.
  17. -1

    A Camaro needs a big ass petrol V8 or else it's not a Camaro. Instead America needs a mid (full size truck of course) size diesel.
  19. it sounds like GM are serious about Europe this time. the last Camaro they sold here was a big ass petrol V8 Camaro. no one bought it.
  20. They shouldn't be worrying about sales in Europe for a Camaro when the Mustang just shit on them in America for an entire decade.
  21. I think GM has struck gold here. Don't put it in the Camaro, that is just wronge. But make it an option for about every other sedan, etc in GM's line up. Exclude the Vette and some models of course.
  22. awesome, since diesel is way cheaper and gets more mpg this could be a succes here.
  23. I just got wood.
  24. A camaro diesel wouldn't sell well IMO
  25. benchmarked means that while they copied current diesels by audi and merc and bmw, when those companies come out with their new diesels gm will already be a generation behind. way to go gm for not being able to do a damn thing without copying the europeans again. americans used to have pride in designing and building things that were new. but no since the 70's weve been all about "benchmarking" and its killing the auto industry.

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