HARDCORE Israel - "free soldier or PM dies"

Discussion in 'General Chat' started by 996 911 Turbo, Jun 30, 2006.

  1. Attacking civilians hurts their political cause. That's not why they do it. They just hate Jews because that's what they've been taught by their parents and schools.
  2. Oh great...
  3. What is the primary GOAL of Hammas and of all the Palestinian factions? A: To end the occupation: a not at all unreasonable goal I would add. Now with Israel unwilling to negotiate in any serious way how do they accomplish their aims?

    Countries/political entities do what makes sense to accomplish their aims. Pitting soldiers against soldiers on a battlefield isn't some game or proxy, and it isn't the only way in which change can be violently effected. E.g. every time the US and its allies attempts to influnce a regeim by starveing its population into submission, destroying their infastructure, and hopefully sapping their will to resist we employ the same exact tactics the Palestinians employ against the occupation (albeit we do it on a vastly more destructive scale and are hence much more effective).
  4. Bullshit. Sure, that's some part of it: no less than many Westeners and especially Jews have been raised to be hostile to Arabs. But if you seriously beleive the enemy are any less rational or moral than you are I don't know what to say other than you're just obviously wrong. These people aren't killbots: they're loving human beings no less than any other, susceptable to the same influences as yourself.
  5. I wasn' risen to hate Arabs, that part came all by itself :p
  6. I thought Israel had withdrew from Gaza last year...
  7. The average palestinian might be pretty normal but the brainwashed suicide bombers are not. Brainwashed religious fanatics have a warped sense of morality and will do anything without hesitation if they have been convinced its right. Its not like you can talk any sense into them either unless you can spare a few years.
  8. You as much as I were raised on a stead TV, movie, and video-game diet of random kalishnakov-weilding Arabs killing innocent people for no good reason.

    Our culture conditions us to believe in the absolute moral right of our civilization, and the absolute evil of our enemies. That may be a good tactict to rally the people. but what's terrifying is that we have LEADERS in the West (e.g. G.W. and crew especially, but certainly not stopping there) who actually believe their own propeganda!

    E.g. I oppose the likes of O.B.L. absolutely, and would relish the chance to exact the more horrible revenge on him and his ilk, but I'm 'with it' enough to realize that he's no psychopath, or at least no more so than any of our leaders who apply violence to their ends. He's a rational, moral man acting within the frame of his society and his experience, and in its preceived interest, no less than G.W.B. or any other leader in history. Very. very. very rately does a true madman rise to power; in fact the inverse is generally true, that the best and brightest tend to rise to the top in all systems and in all societies.
  9. Their reason for existence is to wipe Israel off the map.
  10. The suicide bombers, within Israel and and those targeting the West, tend in fact to be the most educated, Westernized, politicized, and even secularized. Not in all cases, but certainly in most sacrificing oneself for the cause is foremost a political act.

    Also, to my profoundly secular eyes, attempting to liberate ones homeland is far easier to comprehend, than is Israeli's biblical manifest destiny, which is downright insane (the settlements are there because some magic book told the Israeli people the land was theirs in spite of the fact they didn't own it: can you get any crazier than that?!?)
  11. stewacide

    You need to realize something. When the Arabs use the word "occupation", they make no distinction between Israel and the West Bank.
  12. And the stated aim of the Labour Party of the UK (within its founding constitution) is to privitize all industry and institute egalitarian socialism. But don't hold your breath <A BORDER="0" HREF="http://www.supercars.net/PitLane?displayFAQ=y"><IMG BORDER="0" SRC="pitlane/emoticons/wink.gif"></A>

    Many Israeli political parties similarily have as a stated aim to drive the Palestinians totally out of the historical land of Israel, but again salt as needed.

    Instead of spouting slogans and regurgitating the shallowest view of the situation possible, how about try to actually understand the players and the game. E.g. Hammas from top to bottom has long signalled they are willing to live with a 2-state solution in fact: their existing red-line is with legitimizing Israel and its occupation of Palestinian lands (pre-and-post '67)... just as a great many people in Israel maintain the fiction that "the Palestinians don't exist". The facts on the ground trump wide-eyed idealism in their case as in any other...
  13. Again, baseless nonsense. The VAST majority of Palestinians want a real 2-state solution. More in fact, last time I checked, than did Israelis. Poll after poll has demonstrated the Palestinian people to be the more reasoned, measured, and willing to compromise of the two.

    p.s. Why do you think I tend to sympathize their them? Because I'm a closset moslem? Or some bleeding-heart?

    In fact, as the most dis-interested and un-biased of outsiders I don't see how you can come to any other conclusion.
  14. They always make the stereotypical islamic extremist references when I ever see anything about them. The also seem to strongly favour suicide bombings rather than conventional ones which wouldn't make sense if it were just nationalism. People who believe in bible "prophecies" about israel are delusional what more can I say.
  15. he was talking about the mexico/usa al queda situation i proposed. idiot.
  16. Can you link me to those polls?
  17. israel has attempted to kill this guy before, like 10 years back. Israel has kidnapped a bunch of palestine's cabinet as well...they dont give a shit if they are elected.

    and I'm not so sure on the US not doing it if they could reliably figure out where he was. they would of course not announce their intentions and never take responsibility, but they would probably try...
  18. i can't believe no country is correcting israel
  19. they are the ones unwilling to negotiate. israel brings an offer to the table, then they say #$%# you we want all of it, israel goes fine, dont take out offer.
  20. #220 996 911 Turbo, Jul 2, 2006
    Last edited by a moderator: Apr 25, 2016
    they are taught that jews do ritual sacrifice on their holidays. watch "the protocols of zion" which is a study in antisemitism.

    this kind of stuff is stated on TV in eqypt etc as FACT.

  21. Since when do the militias with ties to other countries do what the palestinian people want? The palestinian people might be fine but that doesn't stop the people who have a lot to gain from the conflict being drawn out.
  22. "Hammas from top to bottom has long signalled they are willing to live with a 2-state solution"

    ok, now i know you know nothing.
  23. Why do the settlements exist except to fulfill biblical phophecy? And what is dragging out this mess if not the settlements? These are the kinds of questions Israel-backers in the West never seem to ask themselves.

    And suicide bombing is the weapon of last resort of the truely powerless. If they had the oppostunity sure they'd tilt more towards conventional bombs (as the Islamists are in Iraq and Afghanistan): but the Israeli control apparatus is so tight that it's mostly impractical. Plus the political message sacrificing oneself for ones cause is hard to duplicate any other way...
  24. I am not biased at all. But you on the other hand, you are far as worse as shtew the hobbit and exer 51 regrouped. HAMAS are clearly full of shit individuals who are praising terrrorism and killing jews. You hate Israel no need to hide it, everyone knows it, your anti semitism and your sympathy for the "poor" palestinians and their leaders is worse than sickening. Terrorists need to die end of story.
  25. If you can wear a bomb somewhere crowded they can most likely get away with leaving it somewhere and walking off. They kill themself because they think they will get to go to heaven and because they are to cowardly to risk imprisonment. From their persepective they arn't sacrificing anything.

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