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Discussion in 'American Cars' started by BlackSnake03, Nov 15, 2004.
does anyone have camaroSS or ws6 t/a dyno sheets i remember seeing one before showing peak hp at 357at the crank but unfortunately can't find it
I wonder what the new Cobra is getting at the crank, 425 maybe? The Cobra's competition is the Camaro SS/ws6 t/a, I think the new Cobra takes the cake.
Well since the "new Cobra" is newer that 2002, it's competition isn't the Camaro SS/WS6.
the cobra R was a miserable failure. id like to see them try again with the new car tho. id say within 5 years theyll try again.
These dyno figures that everyone is throwing out about the camaro are greatly exagerated. If all the automakers rate there hp at the wheels now, that would make to 03-04 cobra an easy 420-430hp, again making it much more powerful than a camaro. 360 at the crank is the biggest farce I have ever heard. At the F-body show earlier this year in Des Moines, my friends 99 LS1 SS only put down 291hp at the wheels, the only thing that has been done to it, is an SLP loudmouth. Thats pretty dissapointing for when apparently supposed to be around 360. I don't hate GM, in fact except for the mustang, i like GM better, its just that i've realized that the late model f-bodys are a huge mistake. The couldn't even make a decent interior on them.
About 420 to the crank, and since the F-bodies are no longer built it can't possibly be its factory aimed competition. Fanboy.
Not near all manufacturers rate power at the wheels, not to mention specific models.
Earlier F-bodies will put out less power because it lacked some important changes and equipment that came on later cars. And your friend was still pushing about 345 horses to the crank, so what are you complaining?
Why do you think they were so cheap? Its a $7000 car with a $13,000 drivetrain. Compare an '01 Z28 to an '01 GT, see what I mean?
It is still competition in my book.
not a very fair one though becasue GM couldn't put out a more competitve model. but it is still a good rivalry and the SS and WS6 still do well against the new cobra.
That's true, oh well.
I didnt say take the whole cobra R jackass, i said the motor that was in the cobra R. And i was speaking to various people in my post, not just you. I dont waste my time to go back and see who said what exactly, i dont give that much of a #$%#. And the HP per liter argument would be in Fords favorif you were intelligent enough to do the math (289hp out of a 4.6, and 305hp out of a 5.7) Do the math. Or do you not go to school?
how bout HP to physical size...and weight..darn..ford loses bad there
That is a pretty retarded comparison, the 4.6 is overhead cam, which explains why it is. It weighs more because of cast iron block and stronger internals, which makes it capable of handling so much more power. Both of which are weaknesses in the 5.7, even though it is still a good engine. Both are.
Neither did I dumbshit, do you understand how much money it would cost to get the whole engine setup sharing developmental costs? About $7k more than the Cobra already costs, or $40k. Did you not see the part where I said "use the Cobra R's ENGINE"? I knew education was a problem there but damn.
You're a #$%#in idiot if you have to use the horsepower per liter argument. Does it improve performance, gas mileage, anything? The LS series is still lighter, smaller, and more powerful than the non-supercharged trim.
I still await a dyno from a stock '01 Cobra pushing 289 RWHP. Or if you wanna talk about factory freaks there are LS1 cars pushing 330 RWHP stock. So unless that guy had mods, or was a factory freak...well either way just show me stock '01 cobras pushing 289 RWHP.
I'll be waiting.
DOHC = why it is bigger. Its heavier because its iron.
And what is this "so much more power" stuff? I listed an HPE LS1 with all stock internals running a 9.5 second mile, thats well over 800 RWHP. Those sleeves aint aluminum.
I agree, both are fantastic engines.
AS FAR AS I REMEMBER THE 4.6 COBRA BEFORE '03 WAS #$%#ED. REMEMBER IN 99 THEY HAD A RECALL. I GUESS FORD #$%#ED UP TRYING TO REFINE THE ENGINE. AND THAT 305 TO 320 WAS NOT AT THE WHEELS. KNOW YOUR SHIT BEFORE OPENING YOUR BLUE OVAL MOUTH.
Big deal the Trans Am and SS have 310-320hp all motor, what about the 4.6 cobra before the 03? They had 305-320hp and guess what, it was all motor. Ford just decided to try something different, and they created a car that can hold its own with the vette. As far as putting all this horsepower to a camaro, there are many reasons that no one does it. Everyone seems to ignore how all the camaros have wimpy little 7.5inch rear ends that have trouble taking the beating from the torque of the stock engine. Mustangs have 8.8 rear ends that are nearly as tough a nine inch. Have you ever actually tried to work on a camaro? The engine is stuck halfway up under the dash, and is squeezed on all sides. You can hardly see it. You open the hood on a stang, and you can actually see the engine.
Actually according to the people running the dyno, they said his engine would have 315-325hp at the crank realistically. 345hp at the crank is what the LS1 in the C5's makes as anyone who considers themselves a GM fan knows. GM purposely did not put more power to them because they knew that the drivetrain could not take it. GM was still using the BorgWarner T56 transmission which is known for its weakness, and behind it was the puny 7.5 that can also be found in any S10. They didn't want to put the money into it to make it right. That is one of the things that makes me mad about GM right now, they always back out of building most of there cool concepts because they are too expensive to build, all the while chrysler and ford are building things that GM would have shot down. Lets just hope they finally make a super vette after seeing the Ford GT.
the borg warner t56 is known for its weakness even though they use it in even higher hp cars than the f-bodies. yeah those rear ends are sad but they are capable of handling quit a bit of hp still.
Then he only had like 10% drivetrain loss, which is impossible pretty much. So they're full of shit.
Well then you must not know much about LS1s then, those corvettes had more than 345 to the crank.
Just remember that the Cobra uses a T56.
i drive a 2001 ford taurus............................................................
fool, dark matter generators aren't measured in horsepower. They're measured in goth-power.
God, please put this thread out of my misery. Thank you.
I was exagerating, not a ton more power. But the 4.6 does have stronger internal parts which will allow it to handle more power, not a ton more power, but more power.
That is true, but what I was getting at was blackcobra's "can't handle NEAR the power" comment. I think the max crank horsepower stock bottom end LS1 is like 100 less than the max crankhorse stock bottom end Cobra right now.