Re: 4.5 Cerbera could rape it...

Discussion in '2002 Dodge Viper GTS Final Edition' started by DUFFMAN, Aug 9, 2002.

  1. for 1, whoever started this one is a true piece of shit, cause listen up, 1. Viper costs $75 grand, TVR? hello? for the price of the TVR, u could get like 4,5 maybe six of those Vipers. think about what u say before u say it out loud, so i can actually start writing about important things and not just gay little child responses that take no thought
     
  2. I never said TVR was more reliable.. I just said a variation of it can kill the Viper...which is the Speed 12. Yes..it's Cerbera...a very modified one I believe.

    And Frosty Bollocks...you gotta be damned stupid and ignorant to not understand such a simple post I made.
    Who is more gay? Someone who knows atleast some things bout the Viper..compared to someone who thinks the V10 in a Viper is made for a truck!!?



    DA PUN
    <!-- Signature -->
     
  3. 1) This forum began comparing the Viper to a Cerbera 4.5, not a speed 12.
    2) The Cerbera 4.5 IS more expensive and the Speed 12 is REALLY more expensive at $245,000. And yes the Speed 12 is faster than a viper, I would expect that for more than 3x the price.
    3) STOP posting such stupid freeking forums so we who know about cars don't have to sift through the BS so much.

    Thankyou
     
  4. Hey Frosty,
    Homophobia kinda went out of style, yet ironicly you are probably a TVR fan because of the refined character of the car. Now the Viper is a touch more visible in the racing world, would'nt you say? And Yeah the speed 12 has that awesome engine. Give the Viper to a guy I know named John, and maybe for the price of the '12, he'll kick the shit out of it anywhere. Whoops!

    Stupid statement. Don't you just hate it when someone starts to say "so it beats the blah blah. see what a blah will do to this if i spend the extra cash to make the money even"

    The TVR is a PRODUCTION car. The Viper is a PRODUCTION car. Compare them to each other. If you want to note the price diference then do so. BUT dont say ull spend exrtra on one etc. A stock car can not be compared to a modified car, PERIOD. Its the single most pathetic comparison a person can make.

    And btw, i don't like either the TVR or VIPER, but must say both are great cars. ALSO, i doubt viper fans can really brag about reliability......

    Either way, my point is made. Please pay attention to it.
     
  5. I own a Cerbera and have driven a Viper GTS...

    In back to back tests the Cerbera was faster in a straight line and through the bends. It also brakes better and is more stable.

    Oh and the Cerbera looks better and sounds better ;-)...

    your comparision of racing Vipers to racing Cerberas is a little silly don't you think - if both had had an equal amount of development time it may be a worthwile comparison, as it stands - it's not.

    You can't compare prices either ! A Cerbera 4.5 LW RR is $75K at todays exchange rates in the UK - a new Viper GTS would set you back over $100K in the UK
     
  6. Oh dear. Time to put a few home truths across the pond. The Cerbie 4.5 (unmodified, by the way) is quicker in every performance comparison than a Viper, even this latest incarnation:

    0 to 60 mph in 3.8 secs, 0 to 100 mph in 8.1 secs, 0 to 150 mph in 17.5 secs, Maximum speed 195 mph. From 0-100, the TVR will outdrag a Tornado jet, don't forget. It'll run a standing start mile in 30 secs with a terminal speed of 176mph. So, in other words, it's no slouch. Mind you, the Tuscan S/R is quicker still, but that's a different discussion...

    As for price, you can pick this slice of automotive heaven up for GBP 46K, or USD 67K. I believe this makes it cheaper than the Viper, too. Reliability? No worse than the Dodge.

    As for whether it's better looking, more practical, has a stunning interior, is cheaper to run, etc, well, even the unbiased can't argue the Brit bruiser wins hands down. And handling? Not even a contest.

    Don't get me wrong, I have nothing against 'Yank Tanks' such as the Viper. Nor am I a particularly huge fan of TVR's (I drive an F355 GTS and an Audi), but the fact that stringent emission legislations do not allow TVRs into the US has led to some misconceptions imo. I suspect the majority of posters on this thread have not yet even seen a 2001 Cerbie 4.5, let alone driven one in anger on track. I have, btw.

    And as for the homophobic accusations earlier in the thread, maybe some people on this forum need to get out and grow up a little bit more. All imho, of course.
     
  7. At last someone speaking sense!


    Could it be that DanDare is a member of the evo forum..

     
  8. That's because the Vipers you get in the UK are pussies. I mean, 0-100 in 11 seconds? C'mon, gimme a break.
     
  9. Muzzy66, if your going to quote me, give me the credit, even if you think its a stupid statement.
    The reason I said that is thay someone was comparing this car the '12. Now thats a stupid comparo. I merley said what I did about aftermarket for two reasons.
    1) Hennesey is not exactly some kid in a garage, and thus a bit more fair to consider in this case.
    2) US cars are high potential, lower refinement in most cases. Several people have pointed this out. It is a critical aspect to the US cars. Many are modified beyond what they are on the showroom, as much if not more so than other types of cars. Most people won't mess around under the hood of their Speed 12

    I do agree that if you are just saying well with this turbo kit or that supercharger etc. Is stupid, but not really anymore stupid than comparing the Viper to the '12. The prices put them in different classes.

    As for the 4.5, true, I really don't know much about it. Thats why I'm only talking about the '12 I do know the basics of that car.<!-- Signature -->
     
  10. Just looked at the 4.5 on this site and some others. Now I am impressed, but on paper it will be not "rape" the Viper. It would be damn close. On paper. But the prices, acording to what I have seen, are basicly, for all practical purposes the same for these two.

    Now the weights incline me to beleive that the 4.5 is much more driver freindly, being sucha huge difference. But I really can't say more than that.

    It looks like it comes down to taste.<!-- Signature -->
     
  11. #36 Scott_Mck, Aug 9, 2002
    Last edited by a moderator: Apr 25, 2016
    http://www.stevecarter.com/sq.htm

    Take a look here, it shows the Cerbera is quicker....albeit not by much, but quicker!

    It looks better, sounds better, handles better, the wheel is on the correct side, costs less....

    Have any of you EVER looked inside a Viper, can you honestly say it loks good, there is more plastic in a Viper than Lola Ferrari for christs sakes...then look at the interior of a Cerbera:

    http://www.tvr-eng.co.uk/graphics/cerbera/Framesets/Cerb_frame_int.html

    Looks nice....bespoke is the word, lots of nice leather, brass etc, a touch of class....

    No offence but the Cerbera wins it hands down....as Dandare said above, the Tuscan S/R are even quicker...and cost less!

    Cerbera 4.5's have been verified via GPS at over 200mph....show me the non-racing Viper thats done that...

    Another word, Oversteer....does the Viper actually do anyhting else?

    Just my opinions of course...

    Scott
     
  12. #37 Guibo, Aug 9, 2002
    Last edited by a moderator: Apr 25, 2016
    <!-- QUOTE --><center><hr width="90%"></center><blockquote><i>Quote from DanDare</i>
    <b>Oh dear. Time to put a few home truths across the pond. The Cerbie 4.5 (unmodified, by the way) is quicker in every performance comparison than a Viper, even this latest incarnation:

    0 to 60 mph in 3.8 secs, 0 to 100 mph in 8.1 secs, 0 to 150 mph in 17.5 secs, Maximum speed 195 mph. From 0-100, the TVR will outdrag a Tornado jet, don't forget. It'll run a standing start mile in 30 secs with a terminal speed of 176mph.
    </b></blockquote><center><hr width="90%"></center><!-- END QUOTE -->
    Really? Do have a link to these performance claims? A scanned article? As far as I know, a Cerbera 4.5 has never been tested in the standing mile. Now, if you're talking about the Jeremy Clarkson, video, keep in mind that was allegedly a 4.2 with a 4.5 prototype engine. Some things I've picked up from your neck of the woods (separate responses by different individuals separated by double space):

    "The video is called Unleashed on Cars (I think). The Cerbera did a standing mile in about 32 seconds (from memory.) The rest of the results are
    2-911
    3-Esprit V8
    4-Vantage
    5-Caterham JPE
    6-Viper

    They keepin repeating it on UK Horizons BTW.

    People have also been dubious about whether the Cerbera was a standard car or was modded in order to win. Not the first time a manufacturer would alter a car to win a press test of some sort.

    Don't forget at 30 secs the TVR would be doing about 165-170ish MPH and aerodynamics come into play.

    Yeah, I suppose I expected the 7 to be ahead up to a hundred, and then fall behind cause its as aerodynamic as a brick.
    Even up to 60 it was way behind though.

    I seem to remember the TVR was doing 172 mph at the 1 mile point - The JPE was leading for the first 50 ft or so but then the TVR shot ahead - I too have heard a rumour that this was in fact a prototype 4.5 car but it still won by a HUGE margin...

    I think you're right there, actually.
    Still though, if you write down the 0-100 times that he quotes (which are correct), and then work out what the order should be at 100 mph, the order in the race he does is totally different. It takes a fair amount of skill to get a high performance car off the line, and that was a variable with the drivers used. For all we know, they could have been cameramen and tea ladies.

    31.2 seconds for the standing mile @ 176 mph, iirc. Mind you, many people reckon it was a set up, not least Paul W on this forum who bought a Cerbie on the basis of this video, and then found it to be a lot slower than JC depicted. Who cares? Lovely car."

    Standing mile in 30 seconds? Haha. Prove it!
    BTW, best standing mile time for a US-spec Viper? 30.1 seconds.
    http://members.aol.com/Pdl2thmdl/table2.html

    An ACR from over a year ago did it in 30.4:
    http://www.ultimateviper.com/docs/roadtests.html
     
  13. #38 Guibo, Aug 9, 2002
    Last edited by a moderator: Apr 25, 2016
    <!-- QUOTE --><center><hr width="90%"></center><blockquote><i>Quote from Scott_Mck</i>
    <b> http://www.stevecarter.com/sq.htm

    Take a look here, it shows the Cerbera is quicker....albeit not by much, but quicker!...Cerbera 4.5's have been verified via GPS at over 200mph....show me the non-racing Viper thats done that...

    Another word, Oversteer....does the Viper actually do anyhting else?

    Just my opinions of course...

    Scott</b></blockquote><center><hr width="90%"></center><!-- END QUOTE -->
    Ha, that Steve Carter site is a joke! When was the last time he updated it? Why the hell is a Venom 550 slower than a <i>stock</i> Viper? Ever wondered about that? Hmmm?

    Let's see the verified GPS data on the 4.5 doing over 200 mph. Does it look anything like this?

    http://www.fast-autos.net/tntkingsnake.mov
     
  14. damn Guibo thats fast, one thing though scott about the inside of the cerbera, i dont know if you noticed but its purple. not exactly what i would call "cool", and plastic shmastic i dont know if you've ever been inside of a viper but the one i own is strait leather.
     
  15. You can spec whatever colour interior you wish for the Cerbera. Same goes for the exterior paint colour. Example: One buyer thought the colour of her ski boot was perfect, so the factory matched it and delivered the car to her in that very colour. Now that's what I call service.
     
  16. The Americans are slating something they have never tasted......until they can then we should just leave them to there big, crude tank.

    I wonder what would happen if TVR were to put a pair of bonnet stripes on a Cebera 4.5 or Tuscan S.......would we see the first stock car to get to 0-60mph in less than 2 secs?<!-- Signature -->
     
  17. Think again. It was the Brit car fans that came in here bashing this car. I think this must have been the one of the first threads; this car has only been on this forum for less than a week.
     
  18. <!-- QUOTE --><center><hr width="90%"></center><blockquote><i>Quote from frosty_bollocks</i>
    <b>I think once again TVR has kicked this prehistoric pile of faeces into the litter bin.
    Can someone just put this dying, ageing car out of its misery. </b></blockquote><center><hr width="90%"></center><!-- END QUOTE -->
    Haaahahahahahaha!!!!!!A TVR cerbera? I hope you are not a British cars freak coz you would be sad to know even the TVR speed 12 was raped by the viper in the British GT...
    A cerbera? ahahahahahaha
     
  19. <!-- QUOTE --><center><hr width="90%"></center><blockquote><i>Quote from IvanKaramazov</i>
    <b><!-- QUOTE --><center><hr width="90%"></center><blockquote><i>Quote from frosty_bollocks</i>
    <b>I think once again TVR has kicked this prehistoric pile of faeces into the litter bin.
    Can someone just put this dying, ageing car out of its misery. </b></blockquote><center><hr width="90%"></center><!-- END QUOTE -->
    Haaahahahahahaha!!!!!!A TVR cerbera? I hope you are not a British cars freak coz you would be sad to know even the TVR speed 12 was raped by the viper in the British GT...
    A cerbera? ahahahahahaha</b></blockquote><center><hr width="90%"></center><!-- END QUOTE -->

    You're pretty funny u know!
    The Speed 12 is a new development where the Viper has been running for some years now aswell as being backed by big big big money.
    You probably don't know anything about TVR, they are a tiny and I mean tiny independant car maker which produce quality hand made cars from a small factory in Blackpool. They make amazing cars despite having hardly any money.
    I suggest u do some research before you slate a proud old British mark<!-- Signature -->
     
  20. Listen America!!! TVR make the Speed Twelve you may not have heard of it!! It is capable of 3 sec 0-60 and a top speed of 240+ without turbos or superchargers!!! and is road legal. The Viper in any guise is no-where near this kind of performance nor is it anywhere near the same class of car. European cars are 5000 times better built than any American junkpile on the market. All American cars are bogged down with weight from all your electronic crap eg. cruise control, air con and the rest of the girly rubbish you find in your cars.
     
  21. Blitzstorm,
    Assuming you are not some new identity for one of the losers who have several user names, you should read the posts on the forums, not just the last few. We have already said, just as Guibo put it, that the '12 is not a fair compairison. For the reson that I have stated and Guibo has stated and some others. And as for all the rubish, take a look at the Razor and some other concepts like the GT-40 or Cien. The US has plans for bare bones performance cars as well.<!-- Signature -->
     
  22. <!-- QUOTE --><center><hr width="90%"></center><blockquote><i>Quote from IvanKaramazov</i>
    <b><!-- QUOTE --><center><hr width="90%"></center><blockquote><i>Quote from frosty_bollocks</i>
    <b>I think once again TVR has kicked this prehistoric pile of faeces into the litter bin.
    Can someone just put this dying, ageing car out of its misery. </b></blockquote><center><hr width="90%"></center><!-- END QUOTE -->
    Haaahahahahahaha!!!!!!A TVR cerbera? I hope you are not a British cars freak coz you would be sad to know even the TVR speed 12 was raped by the viper in the British GT...
    A cerbera? ahahahahahaha</b></blockquote><center><hr width="90%"></center><!-- END QUOTE -->
    How did the Tuscan R do?
    How did the Speed 12 do in FIA GT? The French GT? 24 Hours of Spa? 24 Hours of Nurburgring? Le Mans? Daytona? Sebring?
     
  23. Brit, u bring ur Volvos TVRs and BMWs, and we'll bring the M1 Abrams (Vipers, Corvette, Mustang, etc.)
     
  24. #49 Guibo, Aug 9, 2002
    Last edited by a moderator: Apr 25, 2016
    <!-- QUOTE --><center><hr width="90%"></center><blockquote><i>Quote from bikes_suck</i>
    <b>I have here a list of the fastest production cars to hit a kilometer from a standing start. Please look at numbers 21 and 26.
    Cerbera is faster than viper , just accept it.

    PS : if you find any errors in this list please tell us.


    1)19.6", McLaren F1
    2)19.8", Bugatti EB110 Supersport
    3)19.8", Mercedes CLK GTR
    4)21.1", Ferrari F50
    5)21.2", Bugatti EB110
    6)21.6", Lamborghini Diablo GT
    7)21.6", Porsche 959
    8)21.8", Ferrari F40
    9)21.8", Porsche 911 GT2
    10)22.0", Jaguar XJ-220
    11)22.0", Venturi 400 GT
    12)22.1", Lamborghini Diablo SV
    13)22.1", Lamborghini Diablo 6.0
    14)22.4", Porsche 911 Turbo S
    15)22.7", Lamborghini Diablo
    16)22.7", Ferrari F512 M
    17)22.8", Porsche 911 Turbo '95
    18)22.9", Ferrari 550 Maranello
    19)22.9", Porsche 911 Turbo '2000
    20)23.0", Ferrari 512 tr
    21)23.0", TVR Cerbera 4.5
    22)23.2", Porsche 911 Turbo 3.6
    23)23.3", Aston Martin V8 Vantage
    24)23.3", Ferrari 360 Modena
    25)23.3", Ferrari 456M GT
    26)23.4", Dodge Viper GTS</b></blockquote><center><hr width="90%"></center><!-- END QUOTE -->
    Bwahahaha!!! LMFAO!!
    Sushti is right, that's gotta be one of those lilly-livered slack-jawed EURO Vipers. Here's what the US Viper has done to some of those very same cars, many of which are faster than the Cerbera 4.5!:
    (Look at the standing mile times)
    http://www.ultimateviper.com/docs/roadtests.html
    http://www.supras.com/sogi/generations/shootout.htm

    Yes, the Viper also beat the 550 Maranello in the standing mile in '99.
     
  25. Whoever said the Viper has been in more films.....well does that make it a better car?
    The Viper is only loved in America....sure there are a few clubs dotted around the globe but it isn't respected like say a Porsche.
    Most films are made by Americans so they're gonna put a car that everyone likes in a movie.
    The Tuscan caused a great amount of interest on the set of Swordfish and 4 of the directors/crew were after putting an order down.
    TVR isn't well known in the US therefore they always seem to think the Viper is automatically better.
    A quarter mile race doesn't decide which car is better, it's about the cars design aswell.
    American cars like the Viper are generally big, have huge engines and weigh quite a lot.......British cars such as Lotus and TVR have small engines producing low to moderate power outputs, they are generally small and very light.
    I say again.......Americans like the Viper cause it's American....they haven't sampled the TVR yet so they can't comment on it.

    CASE CLOSED!!!!!!! <!-- Signature -->
     

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