Re: Best formula one out there

Discussion in '1950 Morgan +4 Drophead Coupé' started by mher, Aug 10, 2002.

  1. Best formula one out there

    The Mclaren West Mercedes formula one is the best formula one....with possibly the exception of Ferrari...but that's more because of Michael Schumacher than the car.
     
  2. Ferrari wannabe
     
  3. It has almost the same nose as the ferrari, the back is more stylized, like the f2001, but still a beautiful piece of work.
     
  4. Ferrari is #1 in F1

    Ferrari has definitely had the best F1 car since 1999 - in which they won the constructors championship by the way. This car is an evolution from McLarens 2001 car, which compared with Ferrari had neither speed nor reliability. So it wonŽt look good for McLaren this year either.
     
  5. Ferrari is #1 in F1

    Ferrari has definitely had the best F1 car since 1999 - the year which they won the constructors championship by the way and have held it since. This car is an evolution from McLarens 2001 car, which compared with Ferrari had neither speed nor reliability. So it wonŽt look good for McLaren this year either.
     
  6. Ferrari is #1 in F1

    Ferrari has definitely had the best F1 car since 1999 - the year which they won the constructors championship by the way, and have held it to this date. This car is an evolution from McLarens 2001 car, which compared with Ferrari had neither speed nor reliability. So it wonŽt look good for McLaren this year either.
     
  7. Re: Ferrari is #1 in F1

    <!-- QUOTE --><center><hr width="90%"></center><blockquote><i>Quote from Bearing</i>
    <b>Ferrari has definitely had the best F1 car since 1999 - the year which they won the constructors championship by the way, and have held it to this date. This car is an evolution from McLarens 2001 car, which compared with Ferrari had neither speed nor reliability. So it wonŽt look good for McLaren this year either.</b></blockquote><center><hr width="90%"></center><!-- END QUOTE -->

    I would at least wait for the Australian GP to be as optimistic as you are about Ferrari's fate, niether so down-beat towards McLaren's luck for this season. No matter how things seem to be, every season brings some surprises to the fans.<!-- Signature -->
     
  8. Ferrari is the best and Mclaren may have been second last year but look out for BMW. They probably had the most powerful engine this year and have two outstanding drivers, though Shuey will always be best.
    also, keep an eye out for toyota. they may not do so well this coming season but with the resources that company is throwing into their program they may be a contender in a few years.

     
  9. I don't think anyone will win the championship till Schuey Sr. retires, but I think Kimi will show David the way much like Montoya did with Schoey Jr.

    However I believe BMW will challenge Ferrari more often than McLaren, for the simple fact that BMW is highly motivated, they got the car, engine drivers, and Ron Dennis still has many things that need to be sorted out.<!-- Signature -->
     
  10. ferrari wishes they could make cars like these
     
  11. This car does npt really impressw me it is noice but I don't think that it is a winner. It's not the car that wins races its the driver.<!-- Signature -->
     
  12. it say it will do well has it raced yet? if not we gotta sit wait to see how good it is<!-- Signature -->
     
  13. My own opinion is that the biggest problem McLaren-Merecedes had last year was being down on power rather significantly compared to BMW and Ferrari, by some reports as much 50 bhp, although 30 bhp was more likely. The fact that last year's car was competitive at all is a tribute to Adrian Newey and his design team. Newey simply is the best designer out there at the moment. His chassis are very efficient aerodynamically and handle extremely well.

    That this year's car is an evolution of last year's is nothing to take lightly. In fact, to call it a pure evolution would be something of an injustice. The general concept may remain the same, but there have been a lot of significant refinements, and even a few radical changes, the front suspension being the most apparent.

    Another thing to keep in mind is that Newey now has at his disposal arguably one of, if not the most sophisticated wind tunnel facility in the world. He and his team can, and will continue to perform tests and make improvements 24 hours a day, 7 days a week during the entire season.

    And don't expect Mercedes to have sat in a dark corner and cried over last year's poor engine performance. If the rumors are true - and they probably are - then the engineers at Ilmor have cooked up an engine that:

    1) Revs significantly higher and will have closed the power output gap significantly.

    2) Is lighter and more compact, which means more chassis design and packing options for Newey.

    3) And has a 90 degree V-angle creating a lower center of gravity, which translate into better handling for an already great handling chassis.

    But before you jump on me saying that Ferrari and Williams-BMW will also have been making improvements, let me just say I already know that. Performance is a finite quantity. Within the rules of F1 (or any other formula) there is only so much performance obtainable. The question, then, is who comes closest to the limit. All I am saying, here, is that McLaren-Mercedes had more room to improve than Ferrari and Williams-BMW, and that I think hey have probably closed the gap.

    I will stick my neck out, though, and give my (very) early predictions on the season:

    Driver's Title:

    1) Schumi
    2) Juan
    3) David

    Constructor's Title:

    1) McLaren-Mercedes
    2) Ferrari
    3) Williams-BMW

    Comments:

    Ferrari will have the best driver (for one more year until Juan and Kimi fully mature in the series), second best chassis and second best engine, and third best driver line up (sorry, R.B., but I call them as I see them).

    McLaren-Mercedes will have the best chassis, second best driver line up, and third best engine.

    Williams-BMW will have the best driver line up, the best engine, and the third best chassis.

    Wild Card:

    Tires! Michelin and Bridgestone seem to have different design and development strategies. I personally think that Michelin will prevail with the better tires. Depending on how soon and by how much, Ferrari could actually find itself fighting for third.

    In any event, I will be up at 4:30am every race Saturday to watch qualifying live, and every race Sunday at 5:30am to watch the race live.

    - Troy

    P.S. Of course, the best F1 design of all time was the Tyrrell P34. All cars should have six wheels!

     
  14. I do have this to say about Mclaren. every race I have ever been to(2 of them) Mclaren has created the best sound. As loud as these cars are you can actually distinguish the Mclaren from any of the other cars by sound, even when a close pack of them passes. It seems just a note higher than the other cars in the field. Both years I have gone I have been right on the start-finish line at the grand prix of the united states. TV can never do justice to the sound these cars make.
     
  15. Nothing better than a McLaren. Tough to go between a Ferrari and this car, but it might have a little advantage. Not sure though.
     
  16. ok one the reason mclearn was so bad last year they were running to many rpms on thier unreliable engine 17000 is way to many,they wanted to keep up with willam putting on about 18000rpms. what made ferrari so reliable was that they were only runnig 16000rpm and what gave them that extra kick was thier amazing transmission and super engine.don't think that ferrari was running alot more horsepower then mclearn or williams they probably had the least power but what counts in racing is your reliability and consitency and ferrari has both of those.the added bonus tothem is have one of the best f1 drivers of all times micheal schumacher.mclearn wont do much this year it will be mainly ferrari vs. williams
     
  17. Just like last year... it's a battle betwen Ferrari, McLaren-Mercedes and BMW/Williams<!-- Signature -->
     
  18. Does anyone know when(might have already) the specs will come out for BMW/WIlliams' car this year? Very eager to see if they can add some relaibility and chassis improvement to a monster of an engine. <!-- Signature -->
     
  19. <!-- QUOTE --><center><hr width="90%"></center><blockquote><i>Quote from f1 rules</i>
    <b>ok one the reason mclearn was so bad last year they were running to many rpms on thier unreliable engine 17000 is way to many,they wanted to keep up with willam putting on about 18000rpms. what made ferrari so reliable was that they were only runnig 16000rpm and what gave them that extra kick was thier amazing transmission and super engine.don't think that ferrari was running alot more horsepower then mclearn or williams they probably had the least power but what counts in racing is your reliability and consitency and ferrari has both of those.the added bonus tothem is have one of the best f1 drivers of all times micheal schumacher.mclearn wont do much this year it will be mainly ferrari vs. williams</b></blockquote><center><hr width="90%"></center><!-- END QUOTE -->

    Hi, f1_rules. I meant to respond to your post sooner, but work and other committments have gotten in the way. Excuse the misspellings and other mistakes. I writing this with haste.

    If you think 17000 RPM is way too many, then you're going to be in for a bit of a shock. Mercedes-Ilmor engines were running in the 17k range back when they won championships with Mika. Today, they and certainly the upper half of the grid are running over 18k. 20k will almost certainly be reached before the current engine regs are changed in 2007. Attributing engine failures, then, solely to RPM loads is a little simplistic. The root of all failures arise from either design, manufacture or assembly faults. RPM loads are only one of many ways inwhich they can be exposed.

    I do agree that Ferrari should be praised for their reliability. But I think they earned it by paying close attention to the above three areas, and through a never-ending testing schedule, not by artificially capping RPMs to 16000. Ferrai benefits enormously from having their own test track. They are able to literally roll out their cars from the factory and straight onto their track where their test drivers run massive amounts of miles. For sure they know exactly how many stressed laps on the Fiorano track equals a race with Schumacher behind the wheel.

    I also don't buy the 16k theory because with the F1 engine regulations currently in place, RPM is the major factor that determins specific power output. That fact is that in the modern F1 engine, an increase of a 1000 RPM equates to approximately an additional 40-45 HP. I sincerely doubt Ferrari would give up 80-90 HP to their competition!

    Which brings us to Ferrari's transmission. First, Ferrari didn't run their new "revolutionary" transmission last season at all. Infact, there is a good chance that they won't even begin this season running it. They have a lot more testing to do with it if they want to maintain that famous reliability of theirs. The performance M.S. showed in Japan at the end of last season can be attributed to him and Ross Brawn being "in the zone", and (reportedly) Bridgestone doing up some special tires for Michael's car for that one race.

    Second, even when they do run the new transmission, whatever the innovation turns out to be, don't expect it to show a night-and-day difference in performance. Again, the technical regualtions in F1 are fairly comprehensive in terms of what is and isn't allowed. Beyond that, their is doubtfully much power effeciency gains to be had in any new tranny design, certainly not enough to make up a difference of 80-90 HP. My own opion is that the new tranny is more tightly integrated with the engine, thus saving weight and space, all very good things for areodynamic and race engineering choices.

    Finally, as for whether or not it will be a two team race, only time will really tell, though I think this year promises to one of the most exciting seasons in some time.
     
  20. Nice input tga... whoa 20K rpm... very scary...<!-- Signature -->
     
  21. <!-- QUOTE --><center><hr width="90%"></center><blockquote><i>Quote from wutangk2</i>
    <b>ferrari wishes they could make cars like these</b></blockquote><center><hr width="90%"></center><!-- END QUOTE -->

    Well, the fact that you must listen to wutang just proves youre stupid. Either way, Ferrari doesnt wish it could make a car like this. Its already beaten cars like this for 2 years.<!-- Signature -->
     
  22. Tpaguy, I agree with pretty much everything you've said so far; you seem to be one of the few people who actually pay attention to the sport. I do have to disagree with you on one or two things, though. Last year, when McLaren weren't quite as competitive as they should be, it wasn't only due to the relative lack of engine power as compared to Ferrari and BMW, it was partially to do a tad bit of a screw up on Newey's part. Don't get me wrong, he is definitely one of the greatest designers the sport has ever scene, but since the team did not have the new wind tunnel running until before the car was built they ended up with an aerodynamic imbalance between the front and rear end. It had too much rear downforce and not enough front leaving them with some wicked undesteer until they could get it fixed which, of course, they did as quickly as humanly possible. But that still took a while. One more point i'm gonna have to argue is McLaren's probability of closing up on Ferrari and Bimmer. I'm sure the chassis will be better, but the F0110M engine from Mercedes could pose a few problems. As we saw with Renault this year, opening the v-angle of the motor can cause huge reliability troubles(in Renault's case it also caused it to be down on power while they got the damn thing to stop vibrating the car to death). That's why BMW started off in 2000 with a conservatively designed engine that already had a 90 degree V so that they could spend a year learning, and Ferrari, as you stated, has the advantage of their own test track so they can quickly sort out their engines and various other parts. But Mercedes are making the jump from 72-90 degrees this year in an effort to increase bhp, torque and lower the center of gravity in the car. This is all well and good, but like i said, it can bring problems. And i believe we are seeing the signs of these little demons rearing their ugly little heads. Illmor, the company that builds Mercedes F1 engines, have fired one of their head hanchos after they found that there were some problems with the engine that should have been detected very early in the testing process. It's also been reported that the newest itteration of the engine is behind schedule. Not good. So this year could either be one of rousing success for McLaren, or another one of meager achievement and major frustration. So taking all these factors into mind, here are my predictions for the 2002 Championships:
    Drivers Championship:
    1.Michael Schumacher (it's a given)
    2.David Coulthard (this one's iffy)
    3.Juan Montoya (this one's iffy too, he could beat David or be beaten by Kimi)
    4. Kimi Raikkonen (this kid's incredible)
    5.Ralf Schumacher (if Barrichello get's off his ass he could take this spot)
    6. Rubens Barrichello (he's nearly a first-rate driver. the only thing that holds him back is his childish attitude.)

    Constructor's Championship:
    1.Ferrari (they're just too good at this point in time to be ousted from the top)
    2.McLaren (out of the tradition of their rivalry with Ferrari i'm giving them second, but williams could take it if their gets better than it is now)
    3.Williams (...they're car has to get a good bit better if they're too take over McLaren's spot...or if they're to hold off an oustoundingly quick Sauber C21)
    4. Sauber (i really can't see any other team, aside from maybe Renault, coming up to take over this one. if anything is destined for change it would that this team will challenge Williams...stranger things have happened!)
    5. Renault (they look like they're starting to get it together).
    6. BAR (the drivers seem to believe this car has a gargantuan leg up over last year's flop of a racer)

    Of course all of this is, somewhat opinionated, speculation. But this is pretty much the way i see the season shaping up from the way i see things right now. There is one spot where i'm gonna have to somewhat undermine my own pre-judgement, that's the 4th, 5th and 6th placed teams in the Constructor's title. This position will be the most hotly contested out of all of them, so Sauber, Renault and BAR could do a fair bit of switching around. The way i have them listed is a tad bit of a guess...but don't tell anyone...
     

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