Re: Better than the Carrera GT

Discussion in '2002 Lamborghini Murciélago' started by FLY BY, Aug 10, 2002.

  1. BRAVO!!! That's great for the Carrera, but so what, the Murcielago has:

    1. all-wheel drive system.
    2. Traction Control
    3. Disc Brakes
    4. Wings<IMG SRC="http://www.supercars.net/servlets/cMsg/html/emoticons/smile.gif"><!-- Signature -->
     
  2. <!-- QUOTE --><center><hr width="90%"></center><blockquote><i>Quote from TylerDurden</i>
    <b><!-- QUOTE --><center><hr width="90%"></center><blockquote><i>Quote from supraraz</i>
    <b>quote from the dude:
    Damn, let's hope GSolinas isn't the AntiChrist, these idiotic children believe every word he says! I mean, he could say, "Bin Laden can beat up Mike Tyson, I seen them both up close" And half this site would place their bets on Bin Laden! What is this world coming to?

    #$%# off kid. u dont know no shit to talk 2 us like that
    fukin shit man..
    u a #%$ u motha fuka.....
    dont fuk wit us
    *****.......
    </b></blockquote><center><hr width="90%"></center><!-- END QUOTE -->

    supraraz: Why don't you learn some half decent grammar? If there's anything more pathetic than someone who likes to shoot their mouth off, it's someone with poor control of the Engligh language trying to verbally admonish someone they could learn a thing or two from about articulation.

    Second, I never at any point stated that "u [sic] dont [sic] know no [sic] shit to [sic] talk 2 [sic] us like that fukin [sic] shit man.." ([sic] means SPELLING AND/OR GRAMMAR ERROR). I simply formed an opinion that you were fabricating events, since you neglected to give any details about the mysterious "other Porsche" you encountered. Did it ever occur to you that the guy in the Porsche (assuming it was a Turbo, although I'm almost positive the Turbo never came in a convertible format) was just playing with you? You're the only one who knows if you're telling the truth. On the other hand, people who get all hot and bothered over someone calling bullshit on them, usually *are* lying. This may not be the case with you, but I just thought I'd let you know.

    However, you are again digging yourself into a hole by making statements that you fail to back up. The only thing that you have provided that even remotely resembles fact is heresy from gsolinas. The Lambo (which one?) has outperformed every Porsche ever made? What about the 911 GT1? The Dauer-Porsche 962 LM? The 2002 996 GT2 and 1998 993 GT2-R? The 911 GT3 RS? The 959? I could go on. Certainly there are some tracks on which the Murcielago would turn in better times than the latter Porsches that I listed, but pit the Murc against the 959 or 959 S, and the race is over before it even begins. Remember what the 959 did to the F40 on anything but a completely dry track? It left it breathing exhaust fumes. I suggest you do a little research before making those silly claims of yours.

    Also, you have again failed to mention what it is, exactly, that makes your Supra put out "almost 500 horsepower". I'm sure it's not the 6-speed manual transmission you speak of. Wheels are also a definite no-no in the engine power output game. How about some more details?

    P.S. I'm not your "buddy", or your "brother", and in case you haven't noticed, this *is* a Lamborghini forum. Of course there are going to be more people who think the Lamborghini is faster than the Carrera GT.

    P.P.S. Have you caught a glimpse of Porsche's estimates that the Carrera GT will do 0-160 km/h in around 6.5 seconds? Are you aware of the fact that Porsche's claims are always conservative (meaning the cars they produce always meet or exceed their manufacturer's claims)? Consider that the McLaren F1 LM does 0-100mph (0-166 km/h) in 6.7 sec, but with a much taller gear ratio than the Carrera GT will have.</b></blockquote><center><hr width="90%"></center><!-- END QUOTE -->

    ok teacher #$%#in idiot. it's called slang.... and when u r from the streets, that's what u use..... well, i konw that u r a momma's boy, cuz u dont know anythin about slang...... dont worry, ur mom will come and blow u....
     
  3. <!-- QUOTE --><center><hr width="90%"></center><blockquote><i>Quote from supraraz</i>
    <b>quote from the dude:
    Damn, let's hope GSolinas isn't the AntiChrist, these idiotic children believe every word he says! I mean, he could say, "Bin Laden can beat up Mike Tyson, I seen them both up close" And half this site would place their bets on Bin Laden! What is this world coming to?

    #$%# off kid. u dont know no shit to talk 2 us like that
    fukin shit man..
    u a #%$ u motha fuka.....
    dont fuk wit us
    *****.......
    </b></blockquote><center><hr width="90%"></center><!-- END QUOTE -->

    supraraz: Why don't you learn some half decent grammar? If there's anything more pathetic than someone who likes to shoot their mouth off, it's someone with poor control of the Engligh language trying to verbally admonish someone they could learn a thing or two from about articulation.

    Second, I never at any point stated that "u [sic] dont [sic] know no [sic] shit to [sic] talk 2 [sic] us like that fukin [sic] shit man.." ([sic] means SPELLING AND/OR GRAMMAR ERROR). I simply formed an opinion that you were fabricating events, since you neglected to give any details about the mysterious "other Porsche" you encountered. Did it ever occur to you that the guy in the Porsche (assuming it was a Turbo, although I'm almost positive the Turbo never came in a convertible format) was just playing with you? You're the only one who knows if you're telling the truth. On the other hand, people who get all hot and bothered over someone calling bullshit on them, usually *are* lying. This may not be the case with you, but I just thought I'd let you know.

    However, you are again digging yourself into a hole by making statements that you fail to back up. The only thing that you have provided that even remotely resembles fact is heresy from gsolinas. The Lambo (which one?) has outperformed every Porsche ever made? What about the 911 GT1? The Dauer-Porsche 962 LM? The 2002 996 GT2 and 1998 993 GT2-R? The 911 GT3 RS? The 959? I could go on. Certainly there are some tracks on which the Murcielago would turn in better times than the latter Porsches that I listed, but pit the Murc against the 959 or 959 S, and the race is over before it even begins. Remember what the 959 did to the F40 on anything but a completely dry track? It left it breathing exhaust fumes. I suggest you do a little research before making those silly claims of yours.

    Also, you have again failed to mention what it is, exactly, that makes your Supra put out "almost 500 horsepower". I'm sure it's not the 6-speed manual transmission you speak of. Wheels are also a definite no-no in the engine power output game. How about some more details?

    P.S. I'm not your "buddy", or your "brother", and in case you haven't noticed, this *is* a Lamborghini forum. Of course there are going to be more people who think the Lamborghini is faster than the Carrera GT.

    P.P.S. Have you caught a glimpse of Porsche's estimates that the Carrera GT will do 0-160 km/h in around 6.5 seconds? Are you aware of the fact that Porsche's claims are always conservative (meaning the cars they produce always meet or exceed their manufacturer's claims)? Consider that the McLaren F1 LM does 0-100mph (0-166 km/h) in 6.7 sec, but with a much taller gear ratio than the Carrera GT will have.<!-- Signature -->
     
  4. <!-- QUOTE --><center><hr width="90%"></center><blockquote><i>Quote from TylerDurden</i>
    <b><!-- QUOTE --><center><hr width="90%"></center><blockquote><i>Quote from supraraz</i>
    <b>quote from the dude:
    Damn, let's hope GSolinas isn't the AntiChrist, these idiotic children believe every word he says! I mean, he could say, "Bin Laden can beat up Mike Tyson, I seen them both up close" And half this site would place their bets on Bin Laden! What is this world coming to?

    #$%# off kid. u dont know no shit to talk 2 us like that
    fukin shit man..
    u a #%$ u motha fuka.....
    dont fuk wit us
    *****.......
    </b></blockquote><center><hr width="90%"></center><!-- END QUOTE -->

    supraraz: Why don't you learn some half decent grammar? If there's anything more pathetic than someone who likes to shoot their mouth off, it's someone with poor control of the Engligh language trying to verbally admonish someone they could learn a thing or two from about articulation.

    Second, I never at any point stated that "u [sic] dont [sic] know no [sic] shit to [sic] talk 2 [sic] us like that fukin [sic] shit man.." ([sic] means SPELLING AND/OR GRAMMAR ERROR). I simply formed an opinion that you were fabricating events, since you neglected to give any details about the mysterious "other Porsche" you encountered. Did it ever occur to you that the guy in the Porsche (assuming it was a Turbo, although I'm almost positive the Turbo never came in a convertible format) was just playing with you? You're the only one who knows if you're telling the truth. On the other hand, people who get all hot and bothered over someone calling bullshit on them, usually *are* lying. This may not be the case with you, but I just thought I'd let you know.

    However, you are again digging yourself into a hole by making statements that you fail to back up. The only thing that you have provided that even remotely resembles fact is heresy from gsolinas. The Lambo (which one?) has outperformed every Porsche ever made? What about the 911 GT1? The Dauer-Porsche 962 LM? The 2002 996 GT2 and 1998 993 GT2-R? The 911 GT3 RS? The 959? I could go on. Certainly there are some tracks on which the Murcielago would turn in better times than the latter Porsches that I listed, but pit the Murc against the 959 or 959 S, and the race is over before it even begins. Remember what the 959 did to the F40 on anything but a completely dry track? It left it breathing exhaust fumes. I suggest you do a little research before making those silly claims of yours.

    Also, you have again failed to mention what it is, exactly, that makes your Supra put out "almost 500 horsepower". I'm sure it's not the 6-speed manual transmission you speak of. Wheels are also a definite no-no in the engine power output game. How about some more details?

    P.S. I'm not your "buddy", or your "brother", and in case you haven't noticed, this *is* a Lamborghini forum. Of course there are going to be more people who think the Lamborghini is faster than the Carrera GT.

    P.P.S. Have you caught a glimpse of Porsche's estimates that the Carrera GT will do 0-160 km/h in around 6.5 seconds? Are you aware of the fact that Porsche's claims are always conservative (meaning the cars they produce always meet or exceed their manufacturer's claims)? Consider that the McLaren F1 LM does 0-100mph (0-166 km/h) in 6.7 sec, but with a much taller gear ratio than the Carrera GT will have.</b></blockquote><center><hr width="90%"></center><!-- END QUOTE -->


    u r just a fukin #%$....thats all i have 2 say.... ***** go suck ur mom............. #%$
     
  5. Gee do you think it had something to do with the 4 wheel drive system?<!-- Signature -->
     
  6. Jackamo & gsolinas, why don't you two just admit that either you're both Porsche-haterz or Lambo-loverz (or Italian-loverz for that matter since you two are always backing anything that starts with the plaque "Ferrari" or "Lamboghini")?? Just admit it for crying out loud, really...there's nothing wrong with either option. It's just the competitive attitude that made you two looked extremely absurd, especially when you two claimed to "know a lot." Personally, I love Porsche more than anything else, so I'll back it. In this case I'll back it even more, since this argument when on way too long, over data that are either non-factual, or data that has many different variables. I won't say I know a whole lot about cars, but I'll say I know quite a lot about Porsche, at least in terms of the company's history. Porsche will not make a claim that they can't back up, and many of the factory's "claimed" figures are understated to a certain degree, just so that other manufacturers (and wankers like most of you here) cannot have a bar/standard to work with, then to beat it. So here it goes for the TECHNICAL SPECIFICATION of the Porsche Carrera GT, provided by the factory's website. Here's also the link to the same page.


    Engine

    Configuration V10 induction engine with 68° cylinder angle
    Displacement 5.5 liters
    Horsepower 410 kW (558 hp)
    Max. rpm 8200
    Max. torque 600 Nm

    Driveline Rear-wheel drive
    6-speed transmission

    Chassis

    Axles Double wishbone, with pushrods on rear axle activating spring/shock suspension unit and stabilizer coupled with transmission housing
    Steering Power-assisted rack-and-pinion
    Brakes Front axle: 8-piston aluminum alloy Monobloc fixed calipers
    Rear axle: 4-piston aluminum alloy Monobloc fixed calipers
    Porsche Ceramic Composite Brake (PCCB) discs with involuted cooling channel and 380 mm diameter, Dual-circuit ABS

    Wheels Aluminum alloy forged wheels with central locking

    Tires Front axle: 265/30 R 19
    Rear axle: 335/30 R 20

    Weight

    Curb weight 1,250 kg

    Performance

    Top speed Over 200 mph (330 km/h)
    Acceleration 0-60 mph (0-100 km/h) under 4 seconds
    0-120 mph (0-200 km/h) under 10 seconds

    Dimensions

    Length 4,556 mm
    Width 1,915 mm
    Height 1,192 mm
    Wheelbase 2,700 mm
    Front track 1,620 mm
    Rear track 1,570 mm
    Fuel tank capacity 90 l



    Now here's my 2 cents: Not only do I dislike the Murcielago for its looks, I also have no respect for the company, purely because the fact that they have never provide a factory-effort into racing OTHER CARS to prove their cars' worthiness...If they did however, then I don't know about it. And NO, racing those Diablo GTs amongst "themselves" does not count as competing against other marques. If you want to count this as real racing, Porsche is doing it with the 996 GT3 in their Super Cup series, BMW did theirs when the M1 came out long ago, and even Renault did a series like this with their Sport Spider. Racing amongst themselves is more about showmanship than true competition. And the Diablo GT is no exception---just another show. However, I did see them racing one or two cars in the FIA GT Championship in the past, as guests, assumed that they're ran by privateers. I remembered that they were shamefully being lapped by the dominating Vipers and the then-outdated 993 GT2s. Either the drivers weren't trying hard enough, the car just sucked, or the boss told the drivers not to overdrive or crash it otherwise it'll come out of their paycheques.
    In terms of setting records: who gives a fukc? You of all people that aren't half-blind will figure out that these kind of "recording-setting" events are public stunts, mainly to get publicity, to get more photographs into one of thousands of car magazines already in publication. It was VW with their W12 beforehand, now that Lamboghini did theirs, soon someone else is bound to come along and beat it. You want to prove reliabilty? Why don't you please enter a Murcielago or two into the GTS category of Le Mans 24 hours? And at least finish all 24 hours, then come and earn my time listening to your reliability. Honestly, I really would like to see Lamboghini racing in LM24, since it's probably rarer than seeing Lamboghini making an SUV......okay, bad example.

    So much for now. I can go on forever to waste more bandwidth. But for now I'll take a rest.<!-- Signature -->
     
  7. Top Speed 0-60
    Carrera GT 330 kmh 4.0 seconds
    GT2 315 kmh 4.0 seconds
    Murcielago 330 kmh 3.8 seconds
    Point proven.
    Just because it isn't out yet it doesn't mean it hasn't been tested. Granted the Carrera performs very well for an open top but numbers are numbers. The Murcielago out performs it.
    To answer your question, I saw the Carrera GT at the Detroit Auto Show in 2001 when it was still a concept.
    GT2? Maybe you should re-read your specs. Sorry.
     
  8. alright granted I was wrong on the Detroit/Paris Auto Show thing but you also are wrong. The Carrera GT's acceleration is UNDER 4 seconds. The supercars.net people screwed and just wrote 4 seconds. The GT2 has the acceleration of 4.0 seconds but just think for a second. The Gt2 produces less Horsepower and weighs more then the Carrera Gt so you still think the Acceleration is the same? I'm guessing the acceleration is going to be better then the Murcielago. I'm guessing its going to be around 3.3 seconds. The Murcielago produces just 22 more horsepower but the thing weighs like 800lbs more then the Carrera GT. Porsche has racing in its blood so how r u going to say the Murcielago is better?<!-- Signature -->
     
  9. Again I'm going to have to correct you. Though weight distribution and horsepower play a large factor in acceleration so does aerodynamics. It is quite difficult to get the same acceleration from a car with an open top than a hard top even if the car is the same. Ferraris are a classic examples of that (355GTB-355Spider, 360M-360 Spider, 550M-550Barchetta). Possibly if the Carrera GT was a hard top or at least had that option it would have a better acceleration. In defense of Supercars.net I have seen those specs elsewhere as well. The Detroit auto show also posted similar specs beside the car. Granted, Porsche probably modified the car since 2001, but for the time being Murcielago is a quicker car. Besides Lamborghini has a racing history too. They have built racecars for Lotus for some time now.
     
  10. <!-- QUOTE --><center><hr width="90%"></center><blockquote><i>Quote from gsolinas</i>
    <b>Again I'm going to have to correct you. Though weight distribution and horsepower play a large factor in acceleration so does aerodynamics. It is quite difficult to get the same acceleration from a car with an open top than a hard top even if the car is the same. Ferraris are a classic examples of that (355GTB-355Spider, 360M-360 Spider, 550M-550Barchetta). Possibly if the Carrera GT was a hard top or at least had that option it would have a better acceleration. In defense of Supercars.net I have seen those specs elsewhere as well. The Detroit auto show also posted similar specs beside the car. Granted, Porsche probably modified the car since 2001, but for the time being Murcielago is a quicker car. Besides Lamborghini has a racing history too. They have built racecars for Lotus for some time now.</b></blockquote><center><hr width="90%"></center><!-- END QUOTE -->Yeah for the time being cuz the Carrera Gt is not out yet!<!-- Signature -->
     
  11. Its out in the same capacity that the Murcielago is out. They are merely taking orders right now. None are on the road legally yet.
     
  12. A Carrera GT would kick this things ass<!-- Signature -->
     
  13. #14 gsolinas, Aug 10, 2002
    Last edited by a moderator: Apr 25, 2016
    I agree with your Viper theory but explain to me how this car would beat the Murcielago...it just set 3 international records this past Febuary.
    Go to www.lamborghiniregistry.com
     
  14. #15 CarreraGtRacer, Aug 10, 2002
    Last edited by a moderator: Apr 25, 2016
    <!-- QUOTE --><center><hr width="90%"></center><blockquote><i>Quote from gsolinas</i>
    <b>I agree with your Viper theory but explain to me how this car would beat the Murcielago...it just set 3 international records this past Febuary.
    Go to www.lamborghiniregistry.com
    </b></blockquote><center><hr width="90%"></center><!-- END QUOTE -->You told me that they are not out yet and that they are merely taking orders of the Murc. and the Carrera Gt so how can it set 3 records? Then if the Murc. is being tested and is setting records why isn't there info on the Carrera Gt?<!-- Signature -->
     
  15. I'm sure the Carrera GT has underwent a number of tests as well. Maybe no records have been broken and no headlines were made.

    Lamborghini Murcielago is also set to be delivered sooner than the Carrera GT so earlier testings don't surprise me. Some Murcielagos have already been delivered to VIP Lambo clients. I just don't think they are "Officially" out in North America until the summer.
     
  16. Better than the Carrera GT

    I've seen both up close. The Murcielago has a much more impressive look to it and outperforms the Porsche on the track just barely. its got my vote.
     
  17. Where did you see the Murcielago??? I heard it was only shown at the Detroit Auto Show, and somewhere else. Aren't they starting production next year???
     
  18. I saw two at the Detroit Auto Show and two in the Toronto Dealership (Lamborghini of Toronto I think). They are taking orders now so they are already on display.
     
  19. <!-- QUOTE --><center><hr width="90%"></center><blockquote><i>Quote from gsolinas</i>
    <b>I've seen both up close. The Murcielago has a much more impressive look to it and outperforms the Porsche on the track just barely. its got my vote.</b></blockquote><center><hr width="90%"></center><!-- END QUOTE -->hehehe so you want me to speak? How can the Murcielago beat the Carrera Gt on the track when the Carrera Gt isn't even out yet and the specs show that the Gt would have faster acceleration then the Murc? The Carrera Gt could only be seen @ the Paris Auto show so how did you see it in the Detroit show? The Gt2 performs better then the Murcielago on the Track and the Carrera Gt is even better then the Gt2 so by my means the Carrera Gt is better then the Murcielago. Prove me wrong<!-- Signature -->
     
  20. <!-- QUOTE --><center><hr width="90%"></center><blockquote><i>Quote from supraraz</i>
    <b>dude, i agree with u that the murcielago is bettet than the carrera GT because the lambo has more horsepower and it has 3 international records. i have a 1998 toyota supra twin turbo. i was goin to get some stuff for my mom, i stopped at a red light, and i saw this porsche pull up next to me. i had my top down and he had his to. i dont know what kind of a porsche he had, but it sounded good. i think it was a 911 turbo. i burnt him by like 4 seconds to a point which we agreed that we will race till. i am pretty sure that the lambo will beat it. </b></blockquote><center><hr width="90%"></center><!-- END QUOTE -->

    I have no idea what you're trying to say. Yeah, the Lambo has 22 more horsepower, but the Carrera GT weighs 882 lbs. less! Do you have any idea how much of an advantage that is? Look at the 996 Turbo and the '02 Z06. The Turbo has 17 more horsepower, but weighs 375lbs. more than the 'Vette due to its 4WD system and steel chassis (vs. the 'Vette's fiberglass one). On certain tracks, the 'Vette clocks slightly faster times than the 996 Turbo. You're talking about 882 freaking pounds here! Do some calculations and look at the power-to-weight ratio of the Carrera GT vs. the Murcielago. You'll see the Carrera GT's is much, much higher.

    Further, there is *no test data available for the Carrera GT, anywhere*, so how in the hell can you say the Murc is faster?

    Another thing: correct me if I'm wrong, but wasn't 1997 the last model year for the Supra? A (stock, I'm assuming) Supra, beating a Porsche 911 Turbo? Get out of here. Come back when you can lie worth a damn.

    L8R<!-- Signature -->
     
  21. first of all, the lambo might be heavier, but i am pretty sure that it can kick it's ass......
    and second, u shud shut the #$%# up if u dont know no shit. i paid 5,000 $ extra for a 98 supra, and mine is'nt stock..... it has almost 500 horsepower now.... and u tellin me that i am lyin?? check ur shit and then talk 2 me.......
     
  22. We really can't say which one is better, because that would inevitably involve a personal non-factual judgement. But I the Murciélago sure is the most desirable car around, at least in my opinion.<!-- Signature -->
     
  23. Said supraraz: first of all, the lambo might be heavier, but i am pretty sure that it can kick it's ass......and second, u shud shut the #$%# up if u dont know no shit. i paid 5,000 $ extra for a 98 supra, and mine is'nt stock..... it has almost 500 horsepower now.... and u tellin me that i am lyin?? check ur shit and then talk 2 me.......


    I stand corrected; the last model year for the Supra was 1998.

    So, you place a picture of the ABFlug Supra under your post and I'm supposed to believe that it's your car, even though emblazoned at the top right corner of the picture is "Supercars.net"? Come on. Someone who has the pride of owning a tuned Supra would give an exact power figure. You simply state that "... it has almost 500 horsepower now". That doesn't mean much to me. What did you do to the engine to boost its output like that? What kind of transmission are you running to handle that kind of power? A stock tranny certainly won't take "almost 500 horsepower". What are you running in the 1/4 mile? How much did you pay for the Supra, and how much for the mods? You say that you "...paid 5,000 $ extra...". Extra over what?

    Yes, I am telling you that you are lying, because, from experience (not posting, but reading, mind you, in these forums for a long time before I joined) I've seen that brash, hot-headed youngsters like yourself tend to shoot their mouths off a little too much as soon as they join this site.

    Finally, what is it that makes you "...pretty sure that it [the Lambo] can kick [the Carrera GT's] ass"? Provide me with some information on how the Carrera GT performs on a track, and then I'll start taking you seriously. Wait a minute, I just remembered! There *isn't* any performance info on the Carrera GT!

    Believe me, I know enough "shit" to be able to conduct mature discussions about cars on this site. Maybe not enough to completely overpower you with outstanding references like Guibo or rthompson do, but enough to know I have nothing more to say to you.

    L8R<!-- Signature -->
     
  24. <!-- QUOTE --><center><hr width="90%"></center><blockquote><i>Quote from gsolinas</i>
    <b>Again I'm going to have to correct you. Though weight distribution and horsepower play a large factor in acceleration so does aerodynamics. It is quite difficult to get the same acceleration from a car with an open top than a hard top even if the car is the same. Ferraris are a classic examples of that (355GTB-355Spider, 360M-360 Spider, 550M-550Barchetta). Possibly if the Carrera GT was a hard top or at least had that option it would have a better acceleration. In defense of Supercars.net I have seen those specs elsewhere as well. The Detroit auto show also posted similar specs beside the car. Granted, Porsche probably modified the car since 2001, but for the time being Murcielago is a quicker car. Besides Lamborghini has a racing history too. They have built racecars for Lotus for some time now.</b></blockquote><center><hr width="90%"></center><!-- END QUOTE -->


    Well first the Carrera GT had a retractable hard top. Also acceleration to 60 is not very dependant on aero. Also 0-60 times does not determine track performance. The Carrera GT is built from a LMP, so it will do well on the track. It also wieghts at least 700lbs less. It also has ceramic brakes. It also has advanced underbody aero, once again fromt the LMP.


    What race car has lambo built for lotus? Really come on.
     

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