Re: Garbage

Discussion in '2000 Honda S2000' started by rthompson, Aug 9, 2002.

  1. the honda s2000 is a poor rip off of the german made bmw z3 and the porche boxter also the honda civics have modled their cars after the bmw 3 series. They need to learn to get their own design and not copy better made cars.
     
  2. <!-- QUOTE --><center><hr width="90%"></center><blockquote><i>Quote from rmath23</i>
    <b>the honda s2000 is a poor rip off of the german made bmw z3 and the porche boxter also the honda civics have modled their cars after the bmw 3 series. They need to learn to get their own design and not copy better made cars.</b></blockquote><center><hr width="90%"></center><!-- END QUOTE -->

    What design elements does this car steal from the roadsters you mention, pray tell?<!-- Signature -->
     
  3. <!-- QUOTE --><center><hr width="90%"></center><blockquote><i>Quote from Ferox D</i>
    <b><!-- QUOTE --><center><hr width="90%"></center><blockquote><i>Quote from rmath23</i>
    <b>the honda s2000 is a poor rip off of the german made bmw z3 and the porche boxter also the honda civics have modled their cars after the bmw 3 series. They need to learn to get their own design and not copy better made cars.</b></blockquote><center><hr width="90%"></center><!-- END QUOTE -->

    What design elements does this car steal from the roadsters you mention, pray tell?</b></blockquote><center><hr width="90%"></center><!-- END QUOTE -->
    I agree with Ferox. The S2000 is technologically advanced and extremely light. Parts of the Z3 design date back more than 15 years, and the Boxter is a chunky wannabe 911. I don't see any similarities, but maybe you know something I don't. Same goes with the 3er-Civic thing. 2L I4 vs. 3L I6. RWD vs. FWD. Under $20,000 vs over $30,000. What did they take from the 3 series? Also, the companies are not related and their major redesigns have happened on years too close together for any copycatting. Explain what you mean, I'm curious.<!-- Signature -->
     
  4. <!-- QUOTE --><center><hr width="90%"></center><blockquote><i>Quote from BadCrxSi89</i>
    <b>It funny to read most of your replies on this topic. Many of you apparently hate everything about honda. You say that the S2000 is a piece of crap, yet you have compared it to the porsche and have mentioned it in the same paragraph with other true supercars. I don't know a lot about cars, but I can say that S2000 is a very nice car. Not just because it's a Honda, it's because it's an attention getter. What I think is that most of you are upset that Honda are winning the heart of young people. In the old time it was all about Mustangs, Camaros, Vettes and etc..... Today every where you look you will see a young man in an import. I can't explain why that is so I am not going to try. The S2000 may be crap in one category, but overall I thing it's a wonderful car.</b></blockquote><center><hr width="90%"></center><!-- END QUOTE -->

    I disagree with what you said about us being upset that imports are "winning the hearts of young people." I think the FAD is silly, and I love to laugh at them. But I'm certainly not upset about it. I love my Corvette. Before that I loved my Saleen Mustang. I love American cars, Ford, Chevy, and Dodge. I love the whole hot-rod concept (which was started by American cars thank you very much.

    I'm actually happy to see the modified Honda fad. It's taken some of the Chevy vs Ford rivalry away. Since I love all American cars, it's nice that all domestic car lovers have someone to laugh at. Honda.<!-- Signature -->
     
  5. <!-- QUOTE --><center><hr width="90%"></center><blockquote><i>Quote from LanciaDeltaIntegraleS4</i>
    <b>Sean, even if you're laughing at Honda, the guys at Ford and Chevy certainly aren't; Honda is killing them in the passenger car market. Everyone knows that the best minivan is the Odyssey. Everyone knows that an Accord or a Civic is more reliable than a Taurus or Focus (though the Focus has proven to be a good rival so far). Ford pretty much rules the SUV and Truck markets, but the Toyota Land Cruiser and the Toyota Tundra are both very popular, and in some ways superior, alternatives. The Japanese market share is increasing every year, and it shows; American car companies are looking sick these days.

    Where's Oldsmobile? How many cars is Ford taking out of its lineup? There's so little funding for new designs over at GM that new Buicks look ten years old right off the lot.

    Like it or not, the market for cars like the Corvette is pretty small. The limited sales of these great cars cannot carry all the deadweight that is the rest of the lineup. The reason people are so skeptical of American sports cars is that their four-door bretheren have given them a bad name. You can laugh at Honda for making sports cars that are easily beaten by your Corvette, but Honda has so much business sense that someday there may not be a Corvette to compete with. Compared to any of the big three, Honda is a better company that makes better quality (but not necessarily better in general) cars, and that will make them last in the long run.</b></blockquote><center><hr width="90%"></center><!-- END QUOTE -->

    All of that is fine and dandy if you're talking about the stock market. But we're not, we're talking about performance cars. I don't work for Ford, and I don't own any Ford stock. Ford and GM will continue to exist, and they will continue making cars. Ford, GM, and Honda are all very major car manufacturers who sell cars all over the world. Who does better than who financially has no relevance to which performance car I choose. If Honda is making more profit than Ford, GM, or anybody else for that matter, it doesn't make a Honda Civic painted lime green, with a big fin and lots of stickers any less entertaining. <!-- Signature -->
     
  6. i may be mistaken seansvette, but wasn't it you that lost a race to an s2000? i don't think you were the one laughing in that situation. I also don't think that all domestic car owners have the petty adolescent attitude towards the competition that you do. Saying that all domestic car owners laugh at Honda is simply another of your (now famous) ignorant comments. In many ways, the American car makers cannot compete with companies such as Honda. The Accord is still one of the best all-around sedans made by American or Japanese automakers (several articles from various magazine articles support this claim). And as i have said many many times before, the Mustang and the S2000 are not comparable. For the 95th time, the ustang is a large GT car, and the S2000 is a small sports car. Big difference. If you can't think of anything positive to say, SeansVette (or should i say ignoramus), then go bug the people on the Mustang and corvette posts. you'll probably be wanted there.
     
  7. <!-- QUOTE --><center><hr width="90%"></center><blockquote><i>Quote from funkadelicpyro</i>
    <b>i may be mistaken seansvette, but wasn't it you that lost a race to an s2000? </b></blockquote><center><hr width="90%"></center><!-- END QUOTE -->
    if you read that post he claimed to be on foot trying to outrun the S2000, it was a joke (i agree not very funny).<!-- Signature -->
     
  8. <!-- QUOTE --><center><hr width="90%"></center><blockquote><i>Quote from funkadelicpyro</i>
    <b>i may be mistaken seansvette, but wasn't it you that lost a race to an s2000? i don't think you were the one laughing in that situation. I also don't think that all domestic car owners have the petty adolescent attitude towards the competition that you do. Saying that all domestic car owners laugh at Honda is simply another of your (now famous) ignorant comments. In many ways, the American car makers cannot compete with companies such as Honda. The Accord is still one of the best all-around sedans made by American or Japanese automakers (several articles from various magazine articles support this claim). And as i have said many many times before, the Mustang and the S2000 are not comparable. For the 95th time, the ustang is a large GT car, and the S2000 is a small sports car. Big difference. If you can't think of anything positive to say, SeansVette (or should i say ignoramus), then go bug the people on the Mustang and corvette posts. you'll probably be wanted there.</b></blockquote><center><hr width="90%"></center><!-- END QUOTE -->

    Whoa there, killer. I may not agree with everything he says, but Sean seems to be pretty knowledgeable. Calling him an ignoramus is childish, and shunning him isn't the thing you should be doing. You should be leaving. There's no real information in your post, and you're inappropriate to boot, so you shouldn't be here.

    I'm sorry that I brought up the passenger cars, becuase it widened the breadth of the discussion too much. Our Funkadelic Pyro friend is right, the Mustang and the S2000 aren't in the same category, but someone looking for a performance convertable would probably consider both of them before buying.

    =====================================================================

    Anyway, what's everyone's overall evaluation of the S2000? Not relative to other cars, but just the S2000 itself. Is it well-made? Is it quick? Agile? Fun? Ugly? Worthless? I'm actually curious what some of you have to say. Please, no one-word flame posts from people who don't know anything.<!-- Signature -->
     
  9. QUOTE "Anyway, what's everyone's overall evaluation of the S2000? Not relative to other cars, but just the S2000 itself. Is it well-made? Is it quick? Agile? Fun? Ugly? Worthless? I'm actually curious what some of you have to say. Please, no one-word flame posts from people who don't know anything. "

    well it is ok, but i don't care for the styling, it is pretty bland (even moreso in real life than the pictures i have seen). It seems to perform good for what it was intended for, it seems light and agile and i would like to drive one someday, but the styling and lack of torque are important factors in choosing a car that i will keep, i just don't see myself in one.<!-- Signature -->
     
  10. "Anyway, what's everyone's overall evaluation of the S2000? Not relative to other cars, but just the S2000 itself. Is it well-made? Is it quick? Agile? Fun? Ugly? Worthless? I'm actually curious what some of you have to say. Please, no one-word flame posts from people who don't know anything."

    I like it a lot. I like the styling quite a bit myself. I understand it is simply one of the most enjoyable cars you can find to whip around a twisty road, and from everything I've experienced of the car, I'd believe it. <!-- Signature -->
     
  11. <!-- QUOTE --><center><hr width="90%"></center><blockquote><i>Quote from funkadelicpyro</i>
    <b>i may be mistaken seansvette, but wasn't it you that lost a race to an s2000? i don't think you were the one laughing in that situation. I also don't think that all domestic car owners have the petty adolescent attitude towards the competition that you do. Saying that all domestic car owners laugh at Honda is simply another of your (now famous) ignorant comments. In many ways, the American car makers cannot compete with companies such as Honda. The Accord is still one of the best all-around sedans made by American or Japanese automakers (several articles from various magazine articles support this claim). And as i have said many many times before, the Mustang and the S2000 are not comparable. For the 95th time, the ustang is a large GT car, and the S2000 is a small sports car. Big difference. If you can't think of anything positive to say, SeansVette (or should i say ignoramus), then go bug the people on the Mustang and corvette posts. you'll probably be wanted there.</b></blockquote><center><hr width="90%"></center><!-- END QUOTE -->

    HAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAA!!!!!!
    Thank you for that! Ok, you need hooked on phonics. You just proved my point. You decided to make a comment (about me saying I lost to an S2000), without REALLY knowing what the fxck you're talking about. If you actually READ my threat (wow, what a concept), you'll see that it was a joke. I said I lost to an S2000 on foot, NOT driving my Corvette. Go read it. Done reading it? OK good. Now that you feel stupid lets move on the next subject.

    Yes, Hondas make very good, very reliable ECONOMY CARS. The Germans make fantastic sports cars such as Porsche. Italians are world class for their exotics. Every country has something to offer.

    Now here is where American cars come in (if you live in America). You just simply cannot compete with American cars when it comes to bang for the buck. Period. If you spend a given amount of money on a new car, you're going to get much more performance buying American (before and after mods) than any other car makers. That to me, is what's most important. Is that important to a guy like Bill Gates? Probably not, because cost is no object. If he were going to buy a "super car", he'd probably buy something European. To him the difference between spending $250,000 and $10,000 is nothing. For the 99% of the rest of us, getting the most for our money is important.

    You can love any car maker you want, that's your choice. But bash cars like say, the Corvette Z06 as "low tech" is laughable. Any car maker that puts $250,000 worth of performance into a $50,000 car deserves much respect.

    The S2000 is a cool little car. It gets very good reviews from everything I've read. But one common complaint I've read in every review is the lack of torque. The lack of "get up and go." I would much rather feel the force at my back when I punch the gas, than marvel at 120hp per liter. <!-- Signature -->
     
  12. My opinion on the S2000:

    If you know or not, the S2000 is handbuilt by Honda's racing team, which happened to win the Indy Series, and is well capable. The relevence of Honda's outselling of American cars, is that with more profits, more money goes into the research and development, since they have the money to spare. The S2000 was completely designed from scratch by the Honda Formula 1 team. With just about unlimited resources , they tested every possible way to build the car, with drivability, economy, performance, and all aspects of a sports car in mind. With that, they created a car designed to be the showcase of Honda's technology. And it is, driving it is the closest to a race car you can get, in handling. It did come low on torque, but that doesn't matter on the track, since your running in the powerband anyway, with all 250hp at your disposal. With this, i haven't been able to find the limits of this car in a corner. Other than power oversteer(which is easy to prevent), the car is perfectly balanced. It is simply to most fun car to drive that i know of. Steve Millen agrees with that, its in "Road and track" in an issue where they compared the S2000 with an NSX (kind unfair). Anyway, if you dont appreciate Honda's efforts in making this car, then keep to yourself. As for me, i wouldn't take anything else for now.<!-- Signature -->
     
  13. I agree with the bang for your buck comment. As far as "knocked back against your seet" performance goes, only the Americans can deliver for under $50,000. The BMW M3 does that too, but you'd have a hard time finding one for under $50,000. Other than that...I'd say you have to spend somewhere in the $100,000 range to get the same power and acceleration.<!-- Signature -->
     
  14. seansvette-
    1. If you hate imports and the S2000 so much, what are you doing in an S2000 forum? Go to the Corvette ones.

    2. If im not mistaken, you have an automatic corvette? waste of money right there.

    3. I almost bought a Corvette, a 1969 stingray convertible. Now im glad i didnt, since people like you own them. Are all corvette owners as gay as you are? I hope not, thats pretty sad if everyones' like you.

    4. You drive a corvette, where as i actually have history with racing. Have you heard of michael andretti, and newman/haas racing? my dad found the sponsors to start the team. Therefore, i technically have an indycar, which runs a mid 9 1/4 mile. Also, we've raced a roush mustang (First in class, 4th overall, car #70, year 1995) at the Daytona 24 hours, along with a Porsche 911 GT1(#76, year 2001), and a Champion Porsche GT2(#75, year 2000). My dad raced IMSA Camaros, and Datsun GT cars. I've been through Skip Barbar's racing school. Simply with that, i could work you on any track.<!-- Signature -->
     
  15. Ok so daddy is in the race scene and now you are too. What do you want a brownie button? My car is not all that expensive, but I did earn my own way and pay for it on my own. No, Daddy didn't buy me my Corvette like your Daddy paid for your Indy car. And as far as the "gay" comment, where does your fascination with homosexuality come from anyway? It must come from your Daddy's secret touching game he used to play with you when you were five.

    If you like, we can continue this discussion while you're taking my order at the drive through. That is, unless you're still living off of Daddy.

    HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA! <!-- Signature -->
     
  16. Seansvette-
    Let's see here:
    1. I apologize for your aparently abusive parents, please don't take your hate out on a poor import lover (me, if you weren't paying attention.) The "touching" thing...just because your dad touched you like that, doesn't mean everyone's dad does. But, you still didn't answer my question, Are all Corvette owners as big of assholes as you are? If not, i suggest you seek therapy or something, Honda hasn't done anything to you, so, they dont deserve your hate.

    2. I paid for my S2000 as i am paying for my Lexus, the others are paid off. My prelude is for sale, 12,000 if you want it. (haha) The only thing my dad pays for is my college tuition. I work to pay for my cars, and all the mods for them. I work at a computer company, i write basic code for programs, 5 days a week.

    3. I'm proud of my family's history in racing, i would love to follow it up by becoming a racecar driver. So, i'm sorry you have no history to be proud of. That way, you'll never know the feeling of a perfect double clutch downshift...and i'll never drive an automatic corvette.<!-- Signature -->
     
  17. #142 Guibo, Aug 9, 2002
    Last edited by a moderator: Apr 25, 2016
    <!-- QUOTE --><center><hr width="90%"></center><blockquote><i>Quote from IS300andS2000</i>
    <b>You drive a corvette, where as i actually have history with racing. Have you heard of michael andretti, and newman/haas racing? my dad found the sponsors to start the team. Therefore, i technically have an indycar, which runs a mid 9 1/4 mile. Also, we've raced a roush mustang (First in class, 4th overall, car #70, year 1995) at the Daytona 24 hours, along with a Porsche 911 GT1(#76, year 2001), and a Champion Porsche GT2(#75, year 2000). My dad raced IMSA Camaros, and Datsun GT cars. I've been through Skip Barbar's racing school. Simply with that, i could work you on any track.</b></blockquote><center><hr width="90%"></center><!-- END QUOTE -->
    Waitaminute.
    Your dad found the sponsors to start the team. Did you personally help to find these sponsors?
    Are you a driver on the team?
    Are you a mechanic on the team?
    Do you in any way manage the team?
    How much money have you invested in the team?

    How is it that you then "technically have an indycar"?

    Some other points: how extensive is Honda's presence in Indy racing? Is it as great as, greater than, or less than its presence in CART?

    Regarding the S2000's specific output, can we really trust the claim of 120 hp/l (nevermind the 125 hp/l claim), when stock S2000's are dynoing at less than 200 RWHP?
    http://users.ev1.net/~shinglin/cars/s2k/dyno/s2k_1.jpg
    This guy's running a new JR filter, and still can't do better than 191 RWHP:
    http://128.200.136.106/steveuci/MOV02085x.MPG
    His first run netted 185 RWHP, supposedly due to heat soak and a dirty filter.
    From the s2000online.com website, another dyno chart shows that with this filter, another car has trouble breaking the 200-hp threshold:
    http://www.s2ki.com/images/faq_images/jrfilter/jr_dyno02.jpg

    With 194 RWHP, that only comes out to 223 hp at the crank. In other words, 17 hp less than the factory claims. Even the best run with that aftermarket air filter nets only 230 crank hp. And the 185-hp run bone stock translates to 212.75 hp.

    More troubling news: the S2000's engine didn't make Ward's 10 Best Engines list. But the Acura RSX Type-S's engine (with less hp/l) did. And that has as much to do with the value of day-to-day driveability of an engine as anything else. Which leads me to my opinion of the S2000:

    Excellent handling, with good balance, very low weight.
    Can be tricky at the limit, but that's OK; a good sports car should challenge the driver to become better, test his own limits.
    Good overall performance for the money; excellent value for a track car; not so good as a daily driver.
    As a race car, it'd do quite well; as a sports car that has to pull double duty...I'd look elsewhere.
    Looks-wise, I'd put it on a par with the Boxster. But I liked it better the first time around when it was called the BMW Z3.
     
  18. The S2000 was never meant to be a daily driver. The RSX is.<!-- Signature -->
     
  19. <!-- QUOTE --><center><hr width="90%"></center><blockquote><i>Quote from IS300andS2000</i>
    <b>The S2000 was never meant to be a daily driver. The RSX is.</b></blockquote><center><hr width="90%"></center><!-- END QUOTE -->

    The S2000 was never meant to be a daily driver?? How the hell did you draw this conclusion? <!-- Signature -->
     
  20. <!-- QUOTE --><center><hr width="90%"></center><blockquote><i>Quote from SeansVette</i>
    <b><!-- QUOTE --><center><hr width="90%"></center><blockquote><i>Quote from IS300andS2000</i>
    <b>The S2000 was never meant to be a daily driver. The RSX is.</b></blockquote><center><hr width="90%"></center><!-- END QUOTE -->

    The S2000 was never meant to be a daily driver?? How the hell did you draw this conclusion? </b></blockquote><center><hr width="90%"></center><!-- END QUOTE -->

    Just look at the lack of low end torque, that is one tell tale sign of a good daily driver. having to rev the hell out of your car to move it 40 feet in stop and go traffic is just not considered good for daily driving.<!-- Signature -->
     
  21. I disagree. I think that the S2000 is a daily driver. It's not a race car or anything, though it does lack some of the niceties of luxury cars in the same price range. It has an air conditioner and a sound system and it drives like a dream even when you're not going fast. It has about as much torque as the Accord, which you'd have a hard time arguing isn't a daily driver. It's comfortable and versatile, I don't see why you couldn't drive it every day if you had the hard top and the ragtop. Sure, it's not the most convenient car for some things, but neither is a Geo Metro, a Civic hatchback, or a Smart Car.

    I think people argue that it isn't a daily driver because it's a sporty convertible. Well, if you wouldn't be comfortable driving a Miata, Z3, MR2, MG Midget, Triumph TR6, etc. every day, then this wouldn't be your everyday car. That's just a personal preference. The car isn't the limitation as to whether it's a daily driver or not.<!-- Signature -->
     
  22. On another note, I just got my front end aligned...ooh baby, she's back! I guess I did a little to much practice drifting around corners in the snow. Poor little car, she didn't know what was coming when I bought her. Some day, I'll have a high-powered RWD car for playing in the snow and another high-powered AWD car for getting through it.

    By the way, my sweet ride is a 4 Door Honda Accord LX. 5 speed. 4 cylinder. No mods. 14" Pirelli P400s on all four wheels. Mammoth disc breaks up front, beautiful drums out back. 6500RPM redline, 0-60 in 9.2 seconds, STOCK! I think it can do the standing quarter mile, but I've never tried. Beige exterior, Burgundy cloth interior. That's 2932 lbs. of pure, unadultered, adreneline-pumping family sedan. Suck on that, SeansVette, BrownDoggie, and all the rest of you!<!-- Signature -->
     
  23. 0-60 in 9.2 seconds? I'm not sure if my Corvette is capable of such a thing.

    I'm not sure if that was a typo or if you're actually bragging about a 9.2 second 0-60 time. But then again, it IS a Honda. <!-- Signature -->
     
  24. Not a typo, sarcasm. Note: "Mammoth Discs"-they're not more than 6" rotors, "beautiful drums"-who ever heard of beautiful drums?
    9.2 is the factory number, though. I can get 8.5 because I rule.

    Seriously, I like my car because it's the best for what it is: a mid-range sedan. No luxury. No sport. I have fun with it because it's so precise, from the steering to the shifter to the throttle. It's mine and I can appreciate it without it being fast.

    Were you being sarcastic in your reply? Damn these unemotive TrueType fonts!<!-- Signature -->
     
  25. 911 gt2 -3.6 zero to sixty
     

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