Re: the escort cosworths is the best rally car ford ever produce

Discussion in '2002 Ford Focus RS WRC' started by GroupBRules, Aug 9, 2002.

  1. Simply, it wasn't competitive. It was hopelessly outclassed by the Delta and the Celica, and later on the Evo and Impreza.

    Also, hasn't Ford stopped making Cosworths for the road as well? I don't know why they did that but it's probably because of it's poor WRC performances (the Cosworths marketing was largely based on it being a rally car wasn't it?)
     
  2. Ah, thanx for the info. <IMG SRC="http://www.supercars.net/servlets/cMsg/html/emoticons/smile.gif">
     
  3. The escort is acctualy the most winning car in rally history! The Mk1 Escort picked the most of those victorys!!! The Mk1 Escort is the best car ford europe ever made! It's fast, light and it handles great and its competitive in hillclimb even today!!<!-- Signature -->
     
  4. You know, I've seen that claim (Escort is the most winning car in rally history) before, but I must say it's not very enlightening. It is a very vague statement. Could you clear up some points for me, i.e.:

    Is this statement referring to a single model of Escort (for example the RS1600) or are you combining the results of ALL Escort models?

    When you say history of rallying, could you be more specific? For example, do you mean the history of WRC (and it's predecessors) only? Or are you referring to ALL major professional rallying tournaments, such as the European Rally Championship, Asia-Pacific Championship and all national championships?

    Are you also including one-off rally events such as Targa Tasmania, Paris-Dakar, Baja, etc.?

    Are you also including all amateur events, such as historical and club events, as well as professional tournaments?

    Are you including hill climbing?

    Do you have any resources, such as web sites and books, that I can use to verify this claim myself?

    Personally, I only really have an interest in WRC, so I'm not familiar with other rallying events and tournaments, but I do have a bit of an interest in rally history and would be glad of any resources you could point me towards. <IMG SRC="http://www.supercars.net/servlets/cMsg/html/emoticons/smile.gif">
     
  5. By that i meen:

    - Rally from the 1960 -) ("WRC")
    - RS 1600 is a model of the escort that was on the models Mk1 uptil Mk 3
    - If you want to read about it, buy the book "Rally Legends", "RS the faster fords" and "The history of rally"<!-- Signature -->
     
  6. OK, that's a bit clearer. Just a few points though. You seem to be saying you're counting WRC only, yes? But the WRC doesn't stretch back to 1960. The WRC began in 1973, and it's predecessor, the International Makes Championship (IMC), goes back to 1970. (I've seen one, very vague, web site claim the IMC goes back to 1968 but I've not been able to verify this). So did you mean to say WRC from 1970 on?

    I'll assume you mean all IMC/WRC events from 1970, including the F2-only events, WCD-only events and San Remo '86.

    I'm also still not clear on whether you're counting the Escort models seperately or all together. I'll assume you are combining the results for all Escort models.

    If I'm right on both counts, then I have to inform you then that you are wrong. The Escort isn't the most successful car in that period, at that level. The Delta is, followed by the Celica. And I think Tommi's win at Monte Carlo this year puts the Impreza ahead of the Escort as well.
     
  7. I count all escorts from the early RS 2000 to the last escort ever rallying (fabrick made) the escort Cosworth! If you say i'm wrong, i'm happy to learn new things, i hope you can fwd som facts to me!!
    I have problemt to belive that the Celica (been raced for 10 years or so?????) and the Integrale (For 7 years or so?????) Can beat the Escort (Almost 30 years!!!!)
    Please send me some more info my fellow supercar friend !! ;-)
    Summergreatings from Norway!!
    <!-- Signature -->
     
  8. #8 GroupBRules, Aug 9, 2002
    Last edited by a moderator: Apr 25, 2016
    Gladly.

    http://netti.nic.fi/~globe/rally/paradise/

    This website has a heap of WRC statistics. It's a little slow to update on the latest stuff (still missing a few 2001 stats) but is an excellent site. Goes through each WRC car and manufacturer that has won in a number of differently presented tables and goes through the history of all past and present WRC rounds (including pre-WRC days).

    http://www.worldrallying.info/

    This ones's even better and is more up to date, it also covers the IMC championships which Rally Paradise doesn't really do.

    The thing to remeber with regards to the Celica and Delta compared to the Escort is that when the Escort was at it's most competitive (the 70's) there often was a few less rounds in the championships as there are now and during the days of the Celica and Delta. Also, in the 70's and early 80's the Escort had two serious competitors, the Stratos and the 131 Abarth. The Celica and the Delta generally had no competition other than each other.

    The Escort's (and others) fortunes came to a halt when the Quattro hit the scene in the early 80's, which it dominated. Then the mid-80's were dominated by the 205. Ford stopped using Escorts for a while during the Group B days. In fact, Ford were virtually winless at WRC level during the 80's with one win in 1980, 3 in 1981 and 1 in 1988 (with a Sierra). After '81, the Escort wouldn't win again until 1993.

    The late 80's and early 90's were dominated by the Delta and the Celica. The first Delta debuted in '85 and various Delta's were rallied until '92, the Celica first rallied in '82 (at least, that's when it won it's first race) and various Celica's were rallied until '95. From around the years 1987 to 1994, these were about the ONLY cars winning WRC's. Don't believe me? In that period ten manufacturers (Audi, BMW, Datsun/Nissan, Ford, Mazda, Mitsubishi, Opel, Renault, Subaru and VW) managed to win 27 WRC events BETWEEN them. In that same period Toyota (with the various Celicas) won 33 events and Lancia (with the various Deltas) won 46! They won more events themselves than 10 manufacturers combined!

    The Escort did manage a few wins between '94 and '97 (the last year the Escort won at WRC level), which was the tail end of the Celica's time in the WRC and the years the Evo and Impreza began their rise to domination.

    The Escort has an impressive record, no arguments here, but at WRC level at least, it's no longer king of the mountain. But I do believe it was very successful at other levels and continues to be popular at club level, so who knows, maybe it really is the most successful of all.
     
  9. Yea who knows!! ;-)
    Thank you very much my friend!
    I've Really learned a lot!!!<!-- Signature -->
     
  10. You're welcome. <IMG SRC="http://www.supercars.net/servlets/cMsg/html/emoticons/smile.gif">

    I actually just had a quick read of that second website I posted 'cause I was bored. Seems that Celicas had in fact been rallied at WRC level since 1973! However, it seems that most Toyotas rallied before 1976 were Corolla's, so those Celicas might've been privateers.

    Hope you enjoy those websites, I found them to be great reads. <IMG SRC="http://www.supercars.net/servlets/cMsg/html/emoticons/smile.gif">
     
  11. #11 pedern, Aug 9, 2002
    Last edited by a moderator: Apr 25, 2016
    Still! I just love the sound and the looks of the Mk1 escort! I got one! Fitted with a 1620 Kent engnie, 2x40DCOE webers+++, check it out at my homepage; www.lotuscars.onestop.net! <!-- Signature -->
     
  12. interesting.. i watched a vid on the ford escort mk 1, i think that up until when the vid was made (early 90s) the escort mk1 and its several variants held more rally championship wins than any other car, and i like the cosworth.. personally i feel that the cosworth WRC is one of the more interesting cars to watch (and its amazing to hear any that have been fitted with a good antilag system) there are 2 cosworths that are very competitive still down here.. good durable cars.. i dont mind the new focus but its definately not my fave car

    yup a lot of those old toyotas that ran were privateers, i dont think that TTE got into the rally scene until the introduction of the celica gt4, i think that one of the early celicas was the last car to win a world rally event using a live axle in the rear.. useless trivia really but entertaining still
     
  13. No, the best rally car in the history is Lancia Delta Integrale.
     
  14. Don't forget the Peugeot 205, it was very successful.


    The WRC actually dates back to the early '50's though under various different names.
     
  15. He said the escort cosworth is the best rally car FORD ever produced.
     

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