Re: The Viper kicks all foreign pieces of shts asses!!!!

Discussion in '2000 Hennessey Viper Venom 800TT' started by Guibo, Aug 9, 2002.

  1. Be realistic, TVR Speed 12 800bhp and 2250lbs, 800TT 800bho and 3200lbs. Numbers speak for themselves. You american one sided, close minded idiots need to learn that the hennessy is only good on slicks period.
     
  2. Can you show me the evidence that the Cerbera Speed 12 has even been produced for road use?

    The 800TT has never been tested on full race slicks. LOL, that's some "cheating" going on.
     
  3. <!-- QUOTE --><center><hr width="90%"></center><blockquote><i>Quote from BugattiEB110SS</i>
    <b>Be realistic, TVR Speed 12 800bhp and 2250lbs, 800TT 800bho and 3200lbs. Numbers speak for themselves. You american one sided, close minded idiots need to learn that the hennessy is only good on slicks period.</b></blockquote><center><hr width="90%"></center><!-- END QUOTE -->

    Do you seriously think the Speed 12 can plant 800 hp to the ground without "slicks"? BTW, power-to-weight ratio is only part of the battle...<!-- Signature -->
     
  4. <!-- QUOTE --><center><hr width="90%"></center><blockquote><i>Quote from Guibo</i>
    <b>Does anyone have proven performance stats on either the Cerbera Speed 12 or Tuscan R? I'm talking about documented numbers for PRODUCTION cars. Thanks.</b></blockquote><center><hr width="90%"></center><!-- END QUOTE -->

    See what Tuscan R do in competition , quite the same car than the road version.
    Just need a roll cage and remove a few inside parts , and the Tuscan R is ready for race.


     
  5. <!-- QUOTE --><center><hr width="90%"></center><blockquote><i>Quote from Meradur</i>
    <b><!-- QUOTE --><center><hr width="90%"></center><blockquote><i>Quote from BugattiEB110SS</i>
    <b>Be realistic, TVR Speed 12 800bhp and 2250lbs, 800TT 800bho and 3200lbs. Numbers speak for themselves. You american one sided, close minded idiots need to learn that the hennessy is only good on slicks period.</b></blockquote><center><hr width="90%"></center><!-- END QUOTE -->

    Do you seriously think the Speed 12 can plant 800 hp to the ground without "slicks"? BTW, power-to-weight ratio is only part of the battle...</b></blockquote><center><hr width="90%"></center><!-- END QUOTE -->

    Between The Speed 12 and the 800TT it would most likely come down to Power to weight, They both are fron engined, rear drive sports cars with very large multi-cylinder engines. Both seem pretty equal except power to weight
     
  6. Oh and they both have around 800bhp
     
  7. mate...
    we are talking about a turbed P O S

    wheres the Speed 12 is N/A let me think....
    extra 2 cylenders, weights about 1/2 of the dodge...
    yeah sure most of the 800hp of the 12 would go up in smoke but it would SLOUGHTER the Dodge<!-- Signature -->
     
  8. ah your so stupid! you know nothing about cars. a viper would get spanked by a forgin car like a clk-gtr or a porshe 911 gt1. Vipers arent even that great. there straight line cars with no handling. so shut up and do your homework cuz you know nothing.


    P.S. die
     
  9. The Viper only a straight line car with no handling? Looks like you're the one who needs to do homework. Quit living in the past, the Viper turns exceptional.

    <!-- Signature -->
     
  10. Caterham R500: Wolrd's fastest accelerating, true production car for under $100K USD. It also handles far better than a viper. And its cool because it has the sleeper effect. You would never think from the look or sound of the car that it could run 11s in the 1/4 mile. But when you think of the fact that it has the hp/lb of a 700 bhp moddified viper its no wonder that it is so fast. I believe certain TVR Tuscans are faster stock than the viper, for under $100K. If the viper suits you then thatsa great, go buy one. Don't make wild claims about its performance. The viper is fast but not the fastest. But then its not me that you are fooling, only yourself. <!-- Signature -->
     
  11. And as far as vipers handling good...They have high grip but poor handling. If you've ever drifted a car intentionally then you know what I'm talking about. The viper can pull high Gs around a skid pad but there are many cars that handle better. Here is why:
    1. lots of body roll is disorienting in a corner
    2. the viper has high polar moments of inertia...poor yaw control
    3. it has slow, over-boosted steering which leads to poor feed back 4. the viper pitching back and forth causes a loss of precision
    5. wide tires lead to sudden skids with little warning
    6. the vipers handling characteristics change drastically between accererating and braking

    All these things come together to make the viper squirly at its limits, though they are high limits. Even so, most drivers who drive it hard for any length of time find themselves backing it off the track after loosing it in a corner. Grip is important but the viper needs precision to handle good.<!-- Signature -->
     
  12. I'm sick of this. It don't matter to me. If you want to classify it as a production car, fine by me. You have a strong argument, I think I have a strong argument. Oh well, I'll take the quickest acceleration part out. Even though I still stick with the fact its not a true production car. Just I'm sick of all this arguing, I'll just take it out.

    As for the Tuscan being faster. Stop kidding yourself. The fastest TVR under 100,000 is the Cerbera 4.5, and me and numerous others had a discussion about which is faster. The Viper was. Do not start this up again though, if you want to read about it, read the 20+ pages in the Cerbera 4.5 forum.

    Nice post on the handling of the Viper, btw. I agree with you. Even though, it still takes lap times a lot faster than other supercars, thats pretty much all that matters.

    P.S. I sent about 4 different messages, so if many messages appear by me, sorry. It wouldn't send at first. They are pretty much all different too. Constantly changing my opinion.<!-- Signature -->
     
  13. <!-- QUOTE --><center><hr width="90%"></center><blockquote><i>Quote from BugattiEB110SS</i>
    <b> Between The Speed 12 and the 800TT it would most likely come down to Power to weight, They both are fron engined, rear drive sports cars with very large multi-cylinder engines. Both seem pretty equal except power to weight</b></blockquote><center><hr width="90%"></center><!-- END QUOTE -->

    Uh, no it wouldn't. Like I said, LB/HP isn't everything. Look at the Ferrari F50. It's power-to-weight ratio is far better than the stock Viper GTS, but it only beats the Viper by a tenth in the 1/4 mile. I'm sure with it's lower weight, that 800 hp Speed 12 will have a hell of a time trying to gain traction at launch, even with actual race slicks(not DOT approved street slicks).

    Oh yeah, MR2 Guy, you're just saying it takes someone with REAL skillz to pilot the Viper, and they can't be a sissy. I'm sure the 2003 Viper SRT/10 will out handle the Z06 or a 360 Modena, easily.<!-- Signature -->
     
  14. A 1940 VW Beetle requires a lot of skill to drive it at its limits too. So does a semi tractor-trailor. Neither handle good and the Viper falls into this catagory. It may post better lap times than many cars in perfect conditions but that doesn't make it a good track car. Posting one fast lap and making consistent laps for the duration of the race are two very, very, different things. You can take any poor handling car and put fat tires on it for high grip.

    And for the "light cars don't hook up" theory...My dad had an MGA with a 289 and lots of Shelby parts...The engine was never dynoed but the car would, and still will, pull 11.5s in the 1/4 mile on the stock MGA wheels and tires. I don't have the exact numbers but the tires are something like a 165/70 R13. It *could* white smoke the tires past 120 mph if you just punch it and let it spin. The 11.5s where achieved by smoothly feeding in more throttle as the speed built up. The TVR Cerbera Speed 12 would be the same story. If two cars are close in power to weight ratios the one with less hp/lb can win. A Speed 12 is like a Viper with almost 1300 bhp. Its true that I have no proof of the TVR's performance but I do have a pretty accurate acceleration sub program in one of my engineering programs. It indicates that with a smooth throttle feed (like is used with the MGA I spoke of) a Speed 12 could run 0-100 in 5.2 seconds and the 1/4 mile in 9.8 seconds. That is with the standard friction coefficient for street tires. A race compound D.O.T. approved tire was computed at 9.0. And that is an auto-cross tire not a wrinkle-wall like the Mickey Thompson E.T.s used to get the 427TT's 9.2 et. This program actually *under-rates* cars...

    1998 Camaro SS: 14.1
    1999 Corvette Hardtop: 13.5
    1998 Viper GTS: 12.7

    The numbers are a few tenths slower than in real life so you could bet the Speed 12 runs mid 9s in reality...on the stock tires. 8.X would not surprise me on D.O.T. approved drag tires.

    BTW: You don't think the 420 bhp/2600 lb 2000 TVR Cerbera 4.5 could torch a viper? What are you smoking? Light weight is the greatest virtue a car can have in a race. If you went to the track you'd know that. Maybe you could go make a few laps and learn about handling dynamics too.
     
  15. <!-- QUOTE --><center><hr width="90%"></center><blockquote><i>Quote from EmmArTooGuy</i>
    <b>BTW: You don't think the 420 bhp/2600 lb 2000 TVR Cerbera 4.5 could torch a viper? What are you smoking? Light weight is the greatest virtue a car can have in a race. If you went to the track you'd know that. Maybe you could go make a few laps and learn about handling dynamics too.</b></blockquote><center><hr width="90%"></center><!-- END QUOTE -->

    Are you absolutely braindead? Go into the Cerbera 4.5 forum and read about Cerbera vs. Viper. You'll see. Don't make dumbass assumptions that you have no idea about.

    The Cerbera handles poor. Even in the UK, a 400 horsepower, ABS-less Viper will beat a Cerbera around a track. What do you think a 450 horsepower Viper with ABS will do? Don't make assumptions, learn your facts. Thats all I can tell you. It makes you look really retarded.<!-- Signature -->
     
  16. SvSi Viper:
    Actually, the 400-hp Euro Viper without ABS would have a tough time beating the Caterham. The time differential at Nurburgring indicates that between the R500 and a US-spec Viper with 450-460 hp and ABS, it would be pretty close. On a much shorter track, like an autocross course, the Caterham should come out ahead largely due to its weight and narrow width. But then again, a 360 Modena would eat shit against the R500 in such a race, so what does that say?
     
  17. #42 Guibo, Aug 9, 2002
    Last edited by a moderator: Apr 25, 2016
    Ah, my bad. Point well taken, SvSi.

    <!-- QUOTE --><center><hr width="90%"></center><blockquote><i>Quote from EmmArTooGuy</i>
    <b>Light weight is the greatest virtue a car can have in a race. If you went to the track you'd know that. Maybe you could go make a few laps and learn about handling dynamics too.</b></blockquote><center><hr width="90%"></center><!-- END QUOTE -->
    The "greatest" virtue? LOL. How can you make such a simplistic blanket statement? If this were the case, the Caterham R500 would have the quickest lap time at Nurburgring. But it doesn't.
    There are many factors that affect lap times and racetrack performance. Weight is important, but it's by no mean the most important, anymore than many other factors.

    <!-- QUOTE --><center><hr width="90%"></center><blockquote><i>Quote from EmmArTooGuy</i>
    <b>Anyway, I'm saying in a stoplight battle the Cerbera would eat the viper alive.

    Facts are clear:
    http://www.supercars.net/Comp?sourceList=1908&CompList=1908-480
    </b></blockquote><center><hr width="90%"></center><!-- END QUOTE -->
    Do you seriously think this website is 100% accurate. Without at doubt? What kind of "fact" is that?
    In a stoplight battle, the proven stats for both of these cars show the Viper coming out ahead at 60 and the quarter mile.

    <!-- QUOTE --><center><hr width="90%"></center><blockquote><i>Quote from EmmArTooGuy</i>
    <b>The Viper figures aren't much off from R&T's test results. </b></blockquote><center><hr width="90%"></center><!-- END QUOTE -->
    That's the problem. R&T's figures for the Viper are routinely SLOWER than tests by C&D, MT, and Popular Mechanics. Their Z06 stats are slower as well.
     
  18. Wow, they described the TVRs handling in much the same way that many described the handling of the first generation MR2, my favorite driver. I find even the MR2 is sometimes less responsive than I'd like but then I'm exceptionally quick at the wheel. As for my numbers being off, my program said 0-60 = 3.9 and so did that article and so does this site and that is faster than the viper so my statement about a stop light battle is true. It has also been truthfully said that a true sports car chooses it driver, as does the TVR, as does the MR2.

    Concerning the R500: I've seen a rotary powered kit version toast a 1300 bhp turbo 911 at Texas World Speedway's road course, which is open with sweeping curves. The porsche was the closest to beating the Super 7 replica but it still lost. And it had 1300 bhp on a wide open track. A viper would fall under the foot of the R500 easily. As it would fall to the TVR.<!-- Signature -->
     
  19. <!-- QUOTE --><center><hr width="90%"></center><blockquote><i>Quote from EmmArTooGuy</i>
    <b>As for my numbers being off, my program said 0-60 = 3.9 and so did that article and so does this site and that is faster than the viper so my statement about a stop light battle is true.</b></blockquote><center><hr width="90%"></center><!-- END QUOTE -->
    LOL, do you HAVE that copy of EVO sitting in your lap too? The 0-60 and all other performance numbers (except the lap times) were either only estimates, or numbers given to them by the manufacturer. In that test, there ZERO tests for 0-60 and top speed. Didn't you notice the top speed is rather vague for the Cerbera? It wasn't tested.
    Now, here's my challenge to you: Find me an article of a production Cerbera 4.5 hitting those numbers.

    For my part, I'll put up the numbers for the Viper (for the 10th time at least!).

    First off. MT '97. (Dear me, that 0-60 time is quicker than R&T's time for the 993 Turbo as well. And their NSX is .1 second faster than R&T's as well.)
     
  20. #2, C&D '97 test of the Viper RT/10.
     
  21. #3, C&D 0-150-0 article. Dear me, that's the elusive 3.9 second figure.
     
  22. #47 Guibo, Aug 9, 2002
    Last edited by a moderator: Apr 25, 2016
  23. #48 Guibo, Aug 9, 2002
    Last edited by a moderator: Apr 25, 2016
  24. #8
    MT, '99. Dear me. The 550 Maranello did 0-60 in 4.2 seconds. That's .5 seconds FASTER than R&T's Maranello. Are you going to stand by R&T's figures for the Maranello too?
     
  25. #9
    MT's test of the Viper GTS-R. 0-60 in 4.0. 0-100 in 8.8. Quarter mile in 12.1. Now compare them with R&T's 4.2, 9.6 and 12.5. See a pattern? I knew you wouldn't.


    So there you have it. 9 (NINE) tests of the Viper hitting 0-60 in 3.9-4.1 seconds. Yet, you're STILL going to stand by R&T's numbers, (which is no doubt where this site gets its figures from)? I don't have a problem with this site's figures. The truth becomes known when newbies take the numbers at face value without doing any research.

    Now. I'm ready for your 9 tests of the Cerbera 4.5.
     

Share This Page