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Discussion in 'General Chat' started by mclaren777, Apr 11, 2006.
cool. i like warm climates.
i have listened to this stupid shit mc777 posted about halfway through and i have heard no proof of anything, he just keeps saying that its true. #$%# insulin and ice cream, this is bullshit.
hey 78coupe, here's a good time as any to bar morons from the discussion, starting w/ tahoeman.
I'd rather be in hell because I don't wanna hang out with Mc777s.
you cant give a sufficient counterpoint either.
If I have a child knowing full well that one day that individual will die, should I be held responsible for the death of that person?
you didnt have that child knowing how/when they will die.
what if you had a child knowing fully beforehand that that child would kill a specific person on a specific day at specific place at a specific time in a specific way? Sure no one would know that you know, but are you not ULTIMATELY responsible? and would you feel no guilt whatsoever if you were the father? is that what you're saying?
you're trying to compare knowing something general vs knowing something specific. nice try, but thats not a valid point.
This thread is very telling, nice job Luke. The people who so often try to tear down Christianity in other threads are the ones remaining willfully ignorant in this one.
If you look at it that way, then of course, God is ULTIMATELY responsible for everything. He created the world. Is God directly responible for each and every decision made by man? Of course not.
Just as I might be ultimately responsible for my son killing someone, I am not directly responsible for the decision he made, so I cannot be held accountable. I would probably feel guilty, but if the life of my son brought about some greater good overall, then even knowing that he would kill someone, I would know that deciding to have him was the right idea regardless.
so who should get punished? you or the child?
like you didn't expect silverdoman to be a retard
both maybe? im not really sure, but say that situation i stated took place, would YOU as a father personaly have a right to judge the child? and would you as a father be able to feel no blame at all when judge the child as if you had no idea what would happen when you really knew EXACTLY what would happen?
im also not in anyway stating that as far as this earth is concerened we arent responsible for our actions, because we ARE RESPONSIBLE. But how can our creator, who knew all too well what we would all do when he created the universe, then judge us for doing it?
ok, lets take it a little further and say that the father KNOWS the child will reject him every now and then and do what they are told not to do. (every child does this)
Now what does the father do? punish himself? He obviously must discipline the child. The child is still punished by its creator even though the creator knew that the child would do it.
how could you as a father JUDGE YOUR CHILD AT ALL if you know EVERY detail of his future existance and you personaly of your own decision chose to make this child?
This is where it comes down to what each individual christian beleives.
I beleive that God knows where my life is heading, and knows generally what i will and wont do. But i beleive I have choices to make, and these choices were not "planned" by God. They are a result of free will. I beleive that God knows that ultimately, people will reject him, but i dont think he knew every little sin that we were going to do when he made us.
he just happened to know exactly what peter was going to do?
yes he did.
Perhaps its because peter had already made so many choices in his life that God already knew what he was going to do if given the oppertunity. He probably knew where peter would go once he was taken away based on his character, and the choices he had already made in his life.
so based on how well he knew peter, he knew that he would be in the position 3 times to deny jesus and also that a rooster would crow twice? tell me how the rooster fits into the equation
because he planned it?
Being all powerful, he has the ability to plan certain things, and leave other things to our choices.
so the people who asked peter if he was associated with Jesus were planted by God?
quite possibly yes.
So God planted humans and a rooster to #$%# with peter and try to make jesus telling of the future more amazing than it actually was? do you think you could find some other christians that agree with this?
God planted them there for his own good, not to #$%# with him.
Any other christians agree with me?
dont waste your time w/ that burned out husk of a druggie. he's not any good at thinking for himself, even when he's not "agreeing w/ a brainwashing religion".