The engine made it so expensive.

Discussion in '1993 Chevrolet Corvette Coupe ZR1' started by hondalover, Jun 16, 2003.

  1. Re: The engine made it so expensive.

    Comparing countries to states is comparing apples to oranges. GMs headquarters may be in Detroit, but was a Corvette ever built there? Just because GMs headquarters are in Detroit doesnt make every car they create a "Detroit car." Just for heads up the Mustang is a detroit car, becuase its built there...
     
  2. Re: The engine made it so expensive.

    Then name a few things wrong about one of the 3 cars.

    True weight is bad for acceleration, and handling, but were talking about saftey, acceleration isnt a concern, and every car built can turn, and handle a corner at the speed limit. As for traction, since were on earth and there is gravity, the heavier the car the more the traction available. Why do you think that things like tractors are made to be so heavy? They tow things and are off road, they need the weight for the traction. Like i said before if you drive normally you wont roll your SUV.

    Wait i though smaller and lighter cars were safer? Why would a miata (smaller and lighter) have to worry about an Escalade :rolleyes: exacly my point, smaller and lighter cars are NOT safer, unless designed to be so.

    ABS doesnt stop faster? Then why does the "heavy" Viper stop quicker than the "perfectly desgined" Elise?

    Does 911 TURBO mean anything to you? As i said, and i hope youve read the TURBO version was raced against the Z06. The 911Turbo that the Z06 took on has 415hp, and 413ft-lbs of torque, opposed to the Z06s 405hp, and 400ft-lbs of torque, how is that no higher? And since when is the Z06 a limited edition car?

    Ofcourse not bad for a car with half the amount of power. Ive told you i respect and love the Elise, but that just proves that the "brute" Z06 isnt that bad of a track car. If it truly handled that terreble the Elise would be able to crush it. And the accleration times are not that far off, the Elise runs in the 13s while the Z06 runs in the 12s. The only main advantage of the Z06 is its top speed is much higher.

    How many people drive like their racing on the way to work?
    If skidpad and slalom were meaningless test then they would not be done.
     
  3. Re: The engine made it so expensive.

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    GMs headquarters may be in Detroit, but was a Corvette ever built there? Just because GMs headquarters are in Detroit doesnt make every car they create a "Detroit car." Just for heads up the Mustang is a detroit car, becuase its built there...
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    The cars are designed, engineered and funded in Detroit. Where they are built is irrelevant.
     
  4. #154 DragStrip, Jul 8, 2004
    Last edited by a moderator: Apr 25, 2016
    Re: The engine made it so expensive.

    Do all sports car engines have to rev high to make power? The fact that the Viper has alot of torque down low makes it a great street driven car. Something like the S2000 which has all its power and torque up high has many complaints about city driving, having to rev high to keep up with traffic etc. The only thing "truck engine" about it is the block, everything else was changed.

    Vipers handling compared to other supercars, and most more expencive than it. Its compared to the Ford GT, which was compared to the GT3 porche and 360 challange. (the GT ran the fastes lap of the 3 btw)
    http://motortrend.com/roadtests/coupe/112_0401_vipandgt/index.html

    By output if your refering to HP/L, the color of the car is just as an effective comparison to perfomance. HP/L mean nothing in perfomance, try HP-weight or physical size...

    Please explain to me "what handling is about" then. Dont even bother saying its when grip gives out, you already tried that one...

    "Also, Porsche's turbocharged flat-sixes are more efficient that the LS6 because they are turbocharged." Page 2 close to the middle of the page.

    If the Z06 did not handle as good as the M3 then why was it able to stay with the M3 around the turn?

    Like i said before, if slalom tests resaults showed nothing about perfomance then they would not be done. It shows how quickly a car is able to take a sharp turn.

    Thats a good idea, lets just do that!
    In the Car and Driver 10,000hp shootout the Comptech NSX(460hp, 330ft-lbs of torque, 3185lbs) that entered (and got destroyed by just about every car) ran 116.1 seconds on the road course. On that same road course a stock 2002 Z06 ran 110.4 seconds. So much for that idea...

    You seem not to understand how computer aided stability control works on a car. For some (including the vette) its like a traction control, puting the right brakes on to maintain stability. If provoked to much the car slows down, and will not spin, its that simple.

    Remind me again how much a GT2 is(you can buyabout 4 Z06s for 1 GT2)? Why not compare it to the top of the line ferrari while were at it
    too?

    So since some muscle car enthusiest says that then it must be true? I know honda enthusiests that think a VTEC Civic is the best car in the world, since hes an enthusiest he must be right then? The Viper doesnt have a V8 so it isnt a muscle car now?

    Instead of looking at some fan site why not do some reaserch. All muscle cars have a solid rear axle, at the time have luxury features and some technology, most muscle cars were based off other non-perfomance cars, 4 seats 2 doors, RWD. Is a mustang V6 not a muscle car? What is it then? Its just a non-perfomance muslce car, made for moms.
     
  5. Re: The engine made it so expensive.

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    True weight is bad for acceleration, and handling, but were talking about saftey, acceleration isnt a concern
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    Yes, but what speeds up must also slow down. Weight is just as much an obstacle for acceleration as it is for braking, cornering and impacting with other vehicles.


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    and every car built can turn, and handle a corner at the speed limit.
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    Yeah, and so what? I weigh 200lbs but I would never walk across a bridge designed to support a maximum of 200lbs. It would be foolish for me to do so. The fact that any car can turn at the speed limit is faint praise indeed. Cars from 100 years ago can handle corners at the speed limit. In the Delorean I used to own, I would take corners at 2x and 3x the posted limit. There's nothing more satisfying that driving in a 40mph zone at 45mph (reasonable in itself) and then come to a 15mph corner and be able to take it without slowing down... In a car built in 1983.


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    Like i said before if you drive normally you wont roll your SUV.
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    If you drive normally *for an SUV* you won't roll them. The problem is that a lot of people drive them as if they are ordinary cars and they put themselves (and, what is worse, other people) at risk when they do so.

    So, I ask you again, what was the percentage of Ford Mustang owners that were killed in solo rollover accidents as a percentage of Ford Explorer owners who met a similar fate?



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    Why would a miata (smaller and lighter) have to worry about an Escalade
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    If some moron is driving their Escalade as though it were an El Dorado and crashes into the Miata, I'd say the Miata driver will be worried.


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    ABS doesnt stop faster? Then why does the "heavy" Viper stop quicker than the "perfectly desgined" Elise?
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    You're comparing apples and oranges. Why does a VX-220 (essentially a Lotus Elise with a Vauxhall engine and body panels - oh yeah, and ABS) not brake as well as a Lotus Elise without ABS?


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    Does 911 TURBO mean anything to you? As i said, and i hope youve read the TURBO version was raced against the Z06. The 911Turbo that the Z06 took on has 415hp, and 413ft-lbs of torque, opposed to the Z06s 405hp, and 400ft-lbs of torque, how is that no higher?
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    You're talking about the plain, vanilla, 2000 911 Turbo (Porsche makes more than one model of turbocharged 911)? Perhaps the reason that the Corvette beat it is because the Porsche is almost 400lbs heavier and only has 10bhp of extra power to lug that weight around. Oh yeah, and it has a 4WD system which everyone knows is a less efficient way of putting power to the wheels.

    Now, put the Z06 up against a 2004 911 GT2 and the Chevy will limp back home with its tail between its legs.


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    If [the Z06] truly handled that terreble the Elise would be able to crush it.
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    If the Elise had a power:weight ratio even remotely close to the Z06, it WOULD crush it.

    Z06: 405bhp/1414kg = 286bhp/ton
    Elise: 120bhp/710kg = 169bhp/ton

    Even with that discrepancy, the Elise can keep up. Now, imagine an Elise with 203bhp (sufficient to match the 'Vette in power:weight), do you really think the Z06 would stand a chance? Of course not. Wel, actually, to be fair, it would have to have a bit more so that the torque figures match as well. They are the more important for acceeration.

    Now, keep in mind that Lotus engineers have suggested that they can, with adequate development, wring around 300bhp out of that Toyota engine with the right tweaking. I think we're looking at a killer car if they succeed.


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    If skidpad and slalom were meaningless test then they would not be done.
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    That doesn't follow at all.


     

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