Awesome Car, but too much Tech

Discussion in '2006 BMW M6' started by Falcon1, Dec 18, 2004.

  1. I absolutely love the new M6, but what I don't like about it is that it has too much technology. Don't get me wrong I have nothing wrong with adding tech to improve a cars performace, but to take it to this level takes away from the driving experience, for instance stablilty control good for normal driving conditions right? But it hinders the driver from pushing the car to its limits even though it's been "shut off" With that said BMW should have create the M6 with the same drivetrain, but without the electronic leash.
     
  2. In Many ways they could have done better agreed.
     
  3. technology and driving experiance have zero correlation. the porsche 911 is one of the most goodie laden cars out there, but they are one of the most amazing to drive cars in the world. porsches have stability and traction control, infinately variable valve timing, a rediculously complex mcphearson strut system, variable turning ratios, and tons more lil bits of technology that dont hinder the experiance at all. if bMW wanted to make this the greatest driving experiance, they could, but this car isnt designed for that, that is what the M3 is for.
     
  4. actually, the m//drive button on the steering wheel allows the presets to be setup instantly (shift speed, suspension stiffness, steering rate, throttle response, engine tune), and it turns off the traction, stability control, etc. I.e. you drive around normally with all the techy stuff turned on, then hit the button and Boomba! you've gon from 400hp odd to 500hp and with no electronics so you can feel everything.

    Its designed as the track car that you can then drive home in the pouring rain, without it trying to maim you.

    As a side note, i think the 997 sucks A**, its just a souless cyborg-killer, idiot proof version of the 993. A porsche with no lift-off oversteer, FOR SHAME!!!!!! The only real porsches now are the GT3's which are what porsches used to be before they had to "widen their appeal" i.e. dumb them down so any damn fool can drive them. If it doesn't bite you when you do something stupid, it ain't a real porsche

    Still, this car hasnt' got a patch on M635 CSI, or 325i M-spec Alpina edition.

    Is it just me or are M division cars getting VERY pudgy! 1800 kilos? bloody sail barge, same for m5. Even the m3 is getting fat. the original was just over a 1000 kilos and the current is pushing 1500. M Division needs some jenny craig!
     
  5. The M division is trying to make the cars lighter; just look at the CF roof. The problem is that BMW isn't giving them light cars to work with. The E30 M3 was very light because the E30 3 series was very light.
     
  6. The M division is trying to make the cars lighter; just look at the CF roof. The problem is that BMW isn't giving them light cars to work with. The E30 M3 was very light because the E30 3 series was very light.
     
  7. although the 997 may not be the "purests" porsche, neither was the 996, it was watercooler and had non-round headlights. The fact is, theyre still the best car around, period. got CAR's car of the year award.

    and you cant blame porsche for trying to make money, its how they stay independant without a monster buying them out.
     
  8. although the 997 may not be the "purests" porsche, neither was the 996, it was watercooler and had non-round headlights. The fact is, theyre still the best car around, period. got CAR's car of the year award.

    and you cant blame porsche for trying to make money, its how they stay independant without a monster buying them out.
     
  9. although the 997 may not be the "purests" porsche, neither was the 996, it was watercooler and had non-round headlights. The fact is, theyre still the best car around, period. got CAR's car of the year award.

    and you cant blame porsche for trying to make money, its how they stay independant without a monster buying them out.
     
  10. I agree on what's said about the Porsches, even though there's another badass Porsche that's still a treat to drive with NO electonic helpers: GT2. A friend of mine tried it on a track and I asked him afterwards if it was easy to spin around. He'd done it twice during the day.
     
  11. I am very dissapointed in the weight of this car, which seems to be mostly down to the technology. I understand that it's a GT instead of a pure sports car, but why does it have to weigh THIS MUCH? Did they make everything else out of depleted Uranium or what?
    Lots of computers + their support systems (wiring, cooling, etc) are what's making our modern cars so unbelievably chubby. Can you imagine trying to race this car?
    For some reason M keeps trying to be more and more like AMG. If people wanted an AMG, that what they would buy. If they want an M car, they are looking for driving thrills that an AMG and stock BMW cannot give them. A 2 ton coupe just doesn't seem to fall into that category.
    The first M6 is probably my favorite BMW of all time. I can't even muster up excitement for this car.
     
  12. I am very dissapointed in the weight of this car, which seems to be mostly down to the technology. I understand that it's a GT instead of a pure sports car, but why does it have to weigh THIS MUCH? Did they make everything else out of depleted Uranium or what?
    Lots of computers + their support systems (wiring, cooling, etc) are what's making our modern cars so unbelievably chubby. Can you imagine trying to race this car?
    For some reason M keeps trying to be more and more like AMG. If people wanted an AMG, that what they would buy. If they want an M car, they are looking for driving thrills that an AMG and stock BMW cannot give them. A 2 ton coupe just doesn't seem to fall into that category.
    The first M6 is probably my favorite BMW of all time. I can't even muster up excitement for this car
     
  13. You are right, but if you read porsche programs their stability system and traction control to cut in at the last moment. Where as BMW programs their systems to cut in where all the fun starts to begin. Even if you do "shut it off" it is still on. And as the weight even though they used carbon fiber they still could have cut out atleast 100lbs "or 50 kilos for the others" to ofset the power to weight ratio, and one more thing I think the rims look great , but 19 inch rims are too big, so that would equal more unsprung weight which would in turn dampen the suspension response.
     
  14. Simply put, you do not need technology to build a better car.

    Take for example, the new Corvette C6. It uses the "out of date" OHV setup, has very few gizmos on board (with the exception of traction control, which can be turned completely off, unlike Bimmers), and takes the old school principal of putting a large engine in a smallish car to make it fast...

    The Corvette, simply put, outperforms every car in it's price class, and many cars that cost thousands and hundreds of thousands more...IMO, it's closest competitor is in fact the 997 Porsche, but at more than $30,000 more, Ill stick with my Chevy.

    Or, look at the new Mustang. The damn thing still uses a live axle, even the Camaro was fully independent by the 80's. The Mustang kicks ass at $27,000, and this GM boy loves the new 'Stang. Quite frankly, I would rather be driving a new Mustang GT, in Bullet green, 5-speed, on some classic wheels with some red line tires...than the "incredible" M6.
     
  15. there is a bit of misinformation getting around here. number 1, traction control can be turned all the way off on all bmw's. you press the button once to turn it half off, you hold it down for about 10 seconds (or until the traction control light on the dash flashes) and its gone completely. and yes i have tried this a number of times in a number of different new bmw's and it always works. definately try this at home kids.
    second, there are strong rumors going around from credible sources that bmw is working on an m6 csl, working on the same principle as the m3 csl - very little equipment, higher limits for traction control kick in so that it works in your favour, not against it on hte track, more light weight body panels, and more work done to the engine in the induction system and so forth.
    number 3, corvettes, mustangs, etc, yes they sometimes out perform the more expensive cars in acceleration, and on very rare occasions will beat them around a track, however they are nowhere near the driving experience and quality of the more expensive euro cars and the driving experience is where all the fun is at. as a general rule the americn cars may go around a track at the same speed as a euro however the american car wil be a total mess, understeer into a corner and massive snap oversteer on the way out, most bmw's and porsches (for example) will have very slight, steady, easily controlable oversteer through the corner, meaning that you are much more in control in the corner, you can change your line and speed easily midway through a corner like this, you can't when the car is changing its balance 3 or 4 times in the one corner.
    basically, if you are a good driver (i mean a talented track driver) you will get what you paid for. if you are more into slide and giggle type fast driving then a cheaper car may be for you. the money spent becomes evident on the ragged adges of the handling
     
  16. there is a bit of misinformation getting around here. number 1, traction control can be turned all the way off on all bmw's. you press the button once to turn it half off, you hold it down for about 10 seconds (or until the traction control light on the dash flashes) and its gone completely. and yes i have tried this a number of times in a number of different new bmw's and it always works. definately try this at home kids.
    second, there are strong rumors going around from credible sources that bmw is working on an m6 csl, working on the same principle as the m3 csl - very little equipment, higher limits for traction control kick in so that it works in your favour, not against it on the track, more light weight body panels, and more work done to the engine in the induction system and so forth.
    number 3, corvettes, mustangs, etc, yes they sometimes out perform the more expensive cars in acceleration, and on very rare occasions will beat them around a track, however they are nowhere near the driving experience and quality of the more expensive euro cars and the driving experience is where all the fun is at. as a general rule the americn cars may go around a track at the same speed as a euro however the american car wil be a total mess, understeer into a corner and massive snap oversteer on the way out, most bmw's and porsches (for example) will have very slight, steady, easily controlable oversteer through the corner, meaning that you are much more in control in the corner, you can change your line and speed easily midway through a corner like this, you can't when the car is changing its balance 3 or 4 times in the one corner.
    basically, if you are a good driver (i mean a talented track driver) you will get what you paid for. if you are more into slide and giggle type fast driving then a cheaper car may be for you. the money spent becomes evident on the ragged adges of the handling
     
  17. You're kidding right? How much does your cell phone weigh, like 50 pounds? Give me a break, the "technology" of traction control isn't weighing the car down. Some of the traction control is from the brakes. A simple computer gently applies the brakes to a wheel (or wheels) that spin faster than the rest of the wheels.
    Damn those brakes weighing down this awesome car! And damn those microchips for bein' just so friggin' heavy!

    LOL...Next time, just remove what's left of your brain and the car won't be weighed down so much by all the new "technologies".
     
  18. Great point about American cars, but you also must remember the price. Yes I know that Porsches and BMWs have near neutral steering, and well balanced performace, but it's the price that gets the majority of car buyers. I'm sure that once the M6 comes out it will give the GT builders a run for their money, but at a price most "normal" people won't be able to afford. Don't misunderstand me I love most European cars, but for bang for the buck I'll stick to American. Plus there are loads of after market suspensions for the vette and stang being develope that will deacrease under and over steer and boost their performance on the track without even getting close to the price of a Carrera.
     
  19. Ha! You newbies are so darned cute. You really don't seem to know much about the subject, so please don't insult until you have learned a thing or two about cars. I usually don't insult noobs, but you were rude and arrogant enough to do it to me, and I am not feeling all that great this morning.

    There is nothing "simple" about traction control, especially when you get into the 4-wheel EBD/ABS brake systems + intelligent, multi-layered traction settings. And the BMW system does quite a bit more than "gently apply the brakes to the wheels that spin faster", like cutting engine power and selectively braking other wheels at the same time to retain stability. It does it during acceleration and deceleration and at a level of subtlety and sophistication so high that the normal person would never even realive that it's working. That takes several sophisticated computers with a LOT of sensors. And not only is this adding a lot more weight than you would have ever thought, but it is also a large chunk of the cost of these vehicles.

    Ask any real racer and they will let you know just how much weight can be shed by taking these systems out. (And how much of a nightmare it is to get the modern cars to work without them.)
     
  20. is that your vr6 in the avatar? if it is, can you post some more pictures? pretty sweet. what turbo r u gettin?
     
  21. Who the hell said that driving an American car that "is a total mess" isn't any fun? That is the whole point in buying an '05 Mustang GT or an '05 GTO... I could really care less about making around hairpin turns like an M3, I want to be able to swing out the rear and leave a cloud of green smoke and a patch of rubber behind me...

    ...After reading your post, it appears as though A) You are European, and have never truly driven a real American car, or B) you are a complete idiot, and have never driven a real American car.

    Drive something like a 1969 Plymouth Roadrunner with a 440, or a 1970 Chevelle SS 396, and you would understand what I mean. Those cars weren't built to handle, some of them could, but it was all about having FUN.

    I've driven my fair share of Bimmers and Benzes, and for the most part, they are dull/boring and don't offer the fun that Mustangs and Camaros do...With the exception of the AMG line of cars, the German musclecars...
     

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