GM & Ford developing 9- &10-speed transmissions

Discussion in 'Technical' started by CitroenSM, Oct 1, 2012.

  1. #1 CitroenSM, Oct 1, 2012
    Last edited by a moderator: Apr 25, 2016
    Quote from;

    GM, Ford jointly developing 9- and 10-speed transmissions
    Expanded alliance aims to hike fuel economy, trim costs
    Mike Colias
    and Bradford Wernle
    Automotive News -- September 28, 2012 - 6:11 pm ET

    DETROIT -- General Motors and Ford Motor Co. are jointly designing nine- and 10-speed automatic transmissions for use across their lineups in a bid to boost fuel economy.

    GM is leading design of a nine-speed gearbox for use in front-wheel-drive vehicles, said three people familiar with the companies' plans. Ford is taking the lead on a 10-speed transmission for rear-wheel-drive vehicles such as pickups, SUVs and performance cars, the sources said.

    The companies began work on the transmission program early this year, one supplier source said. They still are in the design phase and likely won't be prepared to start production before 2015, the source said.

    The project is expected to produce significant financial savings in engineering and product development for both automakers. The companies would combine the gearboxes with their separate engines via software and hardware.

    A GM spokesman confirmed that the two companies "are in discussions" and have signed a memorandum of understanding "to jointly develop a variety of all-new, fuel-efficient transmissions."

    He would not discuss details and said the companies "hope to announce a definitive agreement soon."

    A Ford spokesman said: "We always talk to other companies including GM." He declined to elaborate.

    The New York Times today reported that the companies plan to jointly develop automatic transmissions and are considering a manufacturing alliance.

    GM and Ford are playing catchup as other automakers hit the market with gearboxes ranging from seven to nine speeds.

    Chrysler Group, through a joint venture with ZF Friedrichshafen, offers an eight-speed automatic in the Chrysler 300 sedan and the 2013 Ram pickup. It is also planning to offer a 9-speed automatic transmission licensed from ZF.

    Audi, BMW and Lexus offer eight-speed gearboxes, while Mercedes-Benz offers a seven-speed.

    Mike Omotoso, powertrain analyst for LMC Automotive in suburban Detroit, says the main benefits of adding more gears are fuel economy and refinement.

    "The engine has to do less work, so they aren't revving as much as they used to with fewer forward gears," he said.

    The partnership expands a transmission alliance dating to 2002, when Ford and GM agreed to work together on a family of six-speed automatics for fwd vehicles.

    The transmissions, including the Ford 6F and GM 6T70, have been installed in millions of vehicles including the Ford Fusion and Escape, and the Chevrolet Malibu and Cruze.

    Ford and GM appear to be altering plans for eight-speed transmissions with an eye toward the greater savings that could come from more gears, one of the sources said.

    In June 2011, Ford announced plans for its own eight-speed automatic, but did not specify an application. The company has said little about the transmission since. Some news outlets reported it will be designed for the F-150 pickup.

    One of the sources with knowledge of Ford's plans says the company scrapped a homegrown eight-speed transmission program within the past year, before it began working with GM.

    Last year, GM CEO Dan Akerson said that GM would spend $204 million to equip its Toledo powertrain plant to produce a homegrown eight-speed transmission. He wouldn't say what vehicles it would go into or when it would reach production.

    Two sources said today that the eight-speed transmission is on track for a mid-2014 launch and likely would go into at least one Cadillac vehicle, likely the next-generation CTS sedan, and eventually GM's pickups and SUVs.

    But one of the sources said that GM has reduced the volume projections for the eight-speed.

    Said the person: "That rear-drive eight-speed is likely to be very, very low volume now."

    You can reach Mike Colias at [email protected]

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  2. I hope they use GM's design for the gearing. I #$%#ing hate rabideau gear sets.
  3. 10 speed is getting silly. They are not lorries ffs
  4. It seems better to go with CVT transmissions.
  5. CVTs still have drive-ability issues.
  6. CVTs are horrid
  7. driveability issues? How?
  8. cos u can't heel 'n toe downshift and double clutch like u should
  9. I owned a car with a CVT. What issues can you think of?
  10. Unless you like rubber-band engine response, fixed gears are still the way to go.
  11. modern CVTs aren't as bad as they used to be.
  12. No, but there's still a lot of room for improvement.
  13. they have alot of issues.
  14. Zero complaints with Subaru's current CVT.
  15. define rubber band engine response. is that what you call putting the needle right in max output range of the engine and having it stick there?
  16. I owned a Dodge with a CVT. There isn't a single issue I can't think of.
  17. in before xDRAN0x

    I drove many CVTs and never really cared. I don't think we need 50 gears, we just need tall I mean pretty #$%#ing tall lasst gear so my 3.0R doesn't rev 2800rpm at 120km/h but really 1500rpm.
  18. My Civic does 3000rpm at 70mph. <A BORDER="0" HREF=""><IMG BORDER="0" SRC="pitlane/emoticons/sad.gif"></A>
  19. never try to get more power out of your engine.
  20. Why would I do that?
  21. Don't mind AMG, he only knows what the magazines tell him.
  22. No, it's when there's an increase in engine revs without a concurrent increase in road speed, and when the road speed finally does start rising, you get too much because you've been over-compensating for the initial lack of acceleration.

    Don't listen to sixspeed, he's a CVT fanboy. And possibly a closet Subaru enthusiast.
  23. Yeah, that's not how it works.
  24. that kinda describes it, i guess. you're tooling along at 50mph with the rev needle sticking at 2100rpm. you decide you want to break out of the right lane so you so use the accelerator to move the needle up to 4000rpm. Over the next five seconds or so, the car moves you up to 55 and then 60mph.

    why that's a bad thing, i have no idea. instead of picking a speed with your foot, youre picking the power output. you still have the issue of overcompensation in geared transmissions, becuase for a given gear, i honestly have no idea where my foot needs to be to get to the speed i want, so i end up see-sawing with the throttle until i get there. in a cvt, at least i have the benefit of a connection between my foot and something useful and something i understand - a relatively quick positioning of the rev counter.
  25. Doesn't the Prius have a CVT?

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