Re: 2002 BMW M3 Vs 2002 Pontiac Trans Am Firehawk

Discussion in '2001 BMW M3' started by BMW M, Aug 9, 2002.

  1. <!-- QUOTE --><center><hr width="90%"></center><blockquote><i>Quote from fenix4116</i>
    <b><!-- QUOTE --><center><hr width="90%"></center><blockquote><i>Quote from BMW M</i>
    <b><!-- QUOTE --><center><hr width="90%"></center><blockquote><i>Quote from fenix4116</i>
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    <b><!-- QUOTE --><center><hr width="90%"></center><blockquote><i>Quote from BMW M</i>
    <b><!-- QUOTE --><center><hr width="90%"></center><blockquote><i>Quote from KaNe</i>
    <b>Well its now clerely obvious who is the winner . . .

    The Firehawk will kick both the Carreras ass and the M3's ass</b></blockquote><center><hr width="90%"></center><!-- END QUOTE -->

    It's okay to dream of your poorly constructed firehawk beating this but it ain't gonna happen. But I bet one dream that's a nightmare for you patriotic losers is the fact that the Camaros and Firebirds are being discontinued.</b></blockquote><center><hr width="90%"></center><!-- END QUOTE -->

    I don't really like f-bodies, but you need to chill out. The Firehawk would beat your beloved m3, and for less $$$, so don't act like an ass.
    </b></blockquote><center><hr width="90%"></center><!-- END QUOTE -->He is correct i would luv to see what kinda of invalid arguement hes gonna make now
    </b></blockquote><center><hr width="90%"></center><!-- END QUOTE -->

    Invalid argument??? Don't make me laugh!!! First of all a Firehawk will NOT beat an M3 in a straight line as the M3 has a 0-60 time of 4.7 seconds. Second of all the M3 is priced higher for the following reasons that a Firehawk lacks: amazing handling, luxury, technology, premium safety, ride quality, sport/city mode, DSC, build quality, longivity, and PRESTIGE. The Firehawk is like the girl with a nice face but lacking in a nice body, personality, and intelligence. The M3 is the complete package!!! And perfect girls are hard to impress thus they are expensive like the M3, whereas avg girls with a nice face come cheap (Firehawk).</b></blockquote><center><hr width="90%"></center><!-- END QUOTE -->Ummm well according to the stats listed here the 2002 model does a 0-60 in 5.1 seconds which is slower then a new Hawk next no where am i seeing skidpad numbers for this car so how do you know it out handles this car? you can not base a price on Prestige/longivity/build quality or else hondas would cost more then anything due to longivity and build quality. thus meaning most of your post was invaild like i said earlier. and the whole comparison you made to girls is based totaly on your opinion Which is anoter 2 or 3 sentences of invalidness galor so maybe next time you will come back with some figures to try to prove the members of the SCF wrong.</b></blockquote><center><hr width="90%"></center><!-- END QUOTE -->

    LOL!!! Alright kid here are some stats: Road and Track did a test on the M3 and got 0-60 in 4.7 seconds as did Motor Trend. This site always has WRONG stats. Sc.net lists the Camaro SS with a 0-60 time of 5.5 seconds when other sources claim 5.2 seconds or less. And if you think that skidpad determines how well a car handles then you're misguided. Have you heard of the slalom or a reliable track like Nurburgring which the M3 has proven its handling capabilities??? The e36 M3 was rated the "best handling car in North America" by Motor Trend a couple years back and the e46 M3 is even better with its traction control. Road and Track also did tests and rated the M3 the best handling car in all types of weather conditions when compared to a 911 and a Z06(which outhandles the Firehawk anyday). So here's your reference moron! Now where's your evidence that the firehawk can beat an M3, oh that's right you have none. And you're a complete bafoon if you think that longivity, build quality, and prestige (as in luxury and class) do not determine the price of a car. Ever heard of a Bentley or a Rolls-Royce??? Both cars are build with such quality and longivity in mind that they can go 15 years without a major tuneup; and each of them carry a $200,000 price tag. So before you run your mouth provide us with some decent evidence.<!-- Signature -->
     
  2. <!-- QUOTE --><center><hr width="90%"></center><blockquote><i>Quote from hsckris</i>
    <b>YES, the Firehawk is faster than the standard corvette, not the Z06. Car and driver, which I believe was your source, claims the Firehawk has a 4.6sec 0-60 time, which I believe was the same time for the M3. How is that better acceleration? The firehawk also has options somewhat comparable to the BMW, like a limited slip differential and 500w Bose stereo system (Bose is the best stock stereo I've ever heard, not in this car, but in others). The luxury of the BMW is obviously greater considering they build luxury cars, pontiac's firehawk was not designed to be a luxury car, but the bonneville was designed to be a moderate luxury car and includes things such as seat memory and gps navigation, like a BMW. If pontiac had meant luxury to be a part of the Firehawk, I'm sure it would be fairly comparable relevant to price. A stock Firehawk will hold its own on the skidpad with .88g, not too far from the M3, especially considering the price and size difference. But I already admitted that the M3 has better handling. I personally don't care about speeding around turns, I just want to win at the light. And with the Firehawk, I probably would in most cases, if I didn't, I'd upgrade it using the money that I saved by getting it instead of an M3. I'll give you the brakes, Firehawk only stops in 196ft from 70 to zero, which isn't bad, but it isn't all that great either. Honestly, I thought it stopped better(all above stats are car and driver). I like the firehawk myself, I also like the M3, and as I said before I will no longer argue b/c you refuse to accept other viewpoints and you act is if an M3 is the best thing on four wheels. I'd just like to say this, Motorweek says, The firehwawk "delivers a remarkably smooth ride for such a highly tuned car," and "Either way, the buyer will get a machine that takes the traditional American muscle car to a new level, that's still well short of bankruptcy." Car and driver says,"The overall presentation is tasteful and fairly restrained" and "The last meal, and it's a good one." I know you can flood the forum with M3 reviews and already have, I just hope I have shown you that Americans can build a good car, and do. The Firehawk isn't even the top of the rim, I would contend that right now the Z06 is, which will definitely outperform BMW's M series(at least in a straight line, which is what i like ). </b></blockquote><center><hr width="90%"></center><!-- END QUOTE -->

    I never thought the Firehawk was a bad car until you started to compare it to a car which is in a completely different class. You're actually the one who refuses to see the other side. You stated that "I personally don't care about speeding around turns, I just want to win at the light. And with the Firehawk, I probably would in most cases, if I didn't, I'd upgrade it using the money that I saved by getting it instead of an M3." How will you beat an M3, when you agreed that the M3 performs equally? And if the M3 has the SMG paddle shifter there is no way a Firehawk will beat it in a straight line as the Avg driver cannot shift that whereas the SMG shifter shifts with top efficiency every time! You keep going on and on about how you could use the money to supe up your Firehawk and beat an M3 but Shirlock you could do that with any car. By your definition I could by a Geo Metro and supe it up to beat your "expensive Firehawk", but does that make the Metro the better car? I don't think so! And I'm glad that it only took a forum flood of facts to make you realize that the M3 has better luxury, handling, braking, safety, and reliability. Notice the sarcasm of it "only" taking a flood of evidence to convince you. And it's glad that you agree that these cars shouldn't be compared when you said that "pontiac's firehawk was not designed to be a luxury car" because the M3 matches performance and gives you amazing luxury for a reasonable price of $50,000. Once again I'll bring up the question that you have failed to answer and cannot answer:

    Name me one American car that gives you the luxury of a Caddilac, the performance of a Corvette, the safety of a volvo, the handling of a Ferrari, top notch braking, the comfort of a Bentley all for $50,000 that the M3 possesses? <!-- Signature -->
     
  3. Believe it or not, there are better cars out there than F-Body's, this is one of them.
     
  4. <!-- QUOTE --><center><hr width="90%"></center><blockquote><i>Quote from hsckris</i>
    <b>say what you want, my arguement consists of alot more than what you claim. maybe if you could read and interpret properly, you'd know that. i am not going to argue with you overly cocky BMW freaks anymore, you think BMW is God's gift to the road and refuse to see other viewpoints. if you wish to remain that close minded, fine by me, I freely admitted several times that the BMW M3 is a good car and has excellent handling. but i'll still be laughing at your a$$ when I dust you on the street, hope to see you there soon so you can catch a glimpse of my tailights going by (and I don't drive a firehawk, though i'd love to sometime). </b></blockquote><center><hr width="90%"></center><!-- END QUOTE -->

    It's funny how you want people to see your point but you do not have any reference or proof to back it up. It's good that you at least are honest in respecting the M3's amazing handling capabilities, but where's your proof that the Firehawk will win in a straight line? The M3 does 0-60 in 4.6 seconds (Car & Driver) while the a regular C5 Corvette does 0-60 in 4.7 seconds. So your telling me that the Firehawk is faster than a Corvette? So it's now clear that the M3 handles better and outaccelerates a Firehawk. Let's talk about braking: Just to give you some leverage I'll use a Corvette's braking distance rather than the far more inferior Firehawk vs the M3:

    Road and Track 60-0 mph, ft.:

    BMW M3- 112 ft.
    Corvette Z06- 118 ft.

    Now that it's been proven that the M3 kills the Firehawk in acceleration, handling, and braking, let's move on to quality and options:

    M3- DSC, climate control, city/sport mode, limited slip differential, dynamic brake control, ABS, dual front airbags and side air bags, head protection air bags, stability control, onboard computer, and anti-theft alarm, remote locking, and much much more.... With all these options the M3 also becomes one of the safest supercars in the world which cannot even be remotely said about the Firehawk.

    And when talking about luxury the M3's genuine premium leather makes you feel what the word "premium" mean while the Firehawk uses either cheap Corvette plastic interior or cheap econo cloth interior. The M3's cabin is a technological masterpiece including the digital tachometer which tells you how to accurately rev in preventing damage to the engine when it's not fully warmed up. Does the Firehawk have any of these options? I didn't think so!!!

    Now let's go to quality: The M3 along with all 3-series vehicles were rated as "very good" in terms of quality while the Firebird and Camaro were rated as "poor" with many flaws that would disgust you in Consumer's Report Automobile Magazine.

    So now it can truly be seen that the M3 is priced good for what it has to offer.

    And as for your Firehawk vs. M3 comparison, I hope I've totally embarrased what ever sad attempt you were making in proving that the Firehawk "performs better".

    Here's a summation of everything that the M3 beats the Firehawk by:

    The M3 wins in acceleration, handling, braking, safety, luxury, quality, and reliability. How do you feel about your shitty Firehawk now? <!-- Signature -->
     
  5. <!-- QUOTE --><center><hr width="90%"></center><blockquote><i>Quote from fenix4116</i>
    <b><!-- QUOTE --><center><hr width="90%"></center><blockquote><i>Quote from Hoseman</i>
    <b><!-- QUOTE --><center><hr width="90%"></center><blockquote><i>Quote from BMW M</i>
    <b><!-- QUOTE --><center><hr width="90%"></center><blockquote><i>Quote from KaNe</i>
    <b>Well its now clerely obvious who is the winner . . .

    The Firehawk will kick both the Carreras ass and the M3's ass</b></blockquote><center><hr width="90%"></center><!-- END QUOTE -->

    It's okay to dream of your poorly constructed firehawk beating this but it ain't gonna happen. But I bet one dream that's a nightmare for you patriotic losers is the fact that the Camaros and Firebirds are being discontinued.</b></blockquote><center><hr width="90%"></center><!-- END QUOTE -->

    I don't really like f-bodies, but you need to chill out. The Firehawk would beat your beloved m3, and for less $$$, so don't act like an ass.
    </b></blockquote><center><hr width="90%"></center><!-- END QUOTE -->He is correct i would luv to see what kinda of invalid arguement hes gonna make now
    </b></blockquote><center><hr width="90%"></center><!-- END QUOTE -->

    Invalid argument??? Don't make me laugh!!! First of all a Firehawk will NOT beat an M3 in a straight line as the M3 has a 0-60 time of 4.7 seconds. Second of all the M3 is priced higher for the following reasons that a Firehawk lacks: amazing handling, luxury, technology, premium safety, ride quality, sport/city mode, DSC, build quality, longivity, and PRESTIGE. The Firehawk is like the girl with a nice face but lacking in a nice body, personality, and intelligence. The M3 is the complete package!!! And perfect girls are hard to impress thus they are expensive like the M3, whereas avg girls with a nice face come cheap (Firehawk).<!-- Signature -->
     
  6. <!-- QUOTE --><center><hr width="90%"></center><blockquote><i>Quote from BMW M</i>
    <b><!-- QUOTE --><center><hr width="90%"></center><blockquote><i>Quote from fenix4116</i>
    <b><!-- QUOTE --><center><hr width="90%"></center><blockquote><i>Quote from Hoseman</i>
    <b><!-- QUOTE --><center><hr width="90%"></center><blockquote><i>Quote from BMW M</i>
    <b><!-- QUOTE --><center><hr width="90%"></center><blockquote><i>Quote from KaNe</i>
    <b>Well its now clerely obvious who is the winner . . .

    The Firehawk will kick both the Carreras ass and the M3's ass</b></blockquote><center><hr width="90%"></center><!-- END QUOTE -->

    It's okay to dream of your poorly constructed firehawk beating this but it ain't gonna happen. But I bet one dream that's a nightmare for you patriotic losers is the fact that the Camaros and Firebirds are being discontinued.</b></blockquote><center><hr width="90%"></center><!-- END QUOTE -->

    I don't really like f-bodies, but you need to chill out. The Firehawk would beat your beloved m3, and for less $$$, so don't act like an ass.
    </b></blockquote><center><hr width="90%"></center><!-- END QUOTE -->He is correct i would luv to see what kinda of invalid arguement hes gonna make now
    </b></blockquote><center><hr width="90%"></center><!-- END QUOTE -->

    Invalid argument??? Don't make me laugh!!! First of all a Firehawk will NOT beat an M3 in a straight line as the M3 has a 0-60 time of 4.7 seconds. Second of all the M3 is priced higher for the following reasons that a Firehawk lacks: amazing handling, luxury, technology, premium safety, ride quality, sport/city mode, DSC, build quality, longivity, and PRESTIGE. The Firehawk is like the girl with a nice face but lacking in a nice body, personality, and intelligence. The M3 is the complete package!!! And perfect girls are hard to impress thus they are expensive like the M3, whereas avg girls with a nice face come cheap (Firehawk).</b></blockquote><center><hr width="90%"></center><!-- END QUOTE -->Ummm well according to the stats listed here the 2002 model does a 0-60 in 5.1 seconds which is slower then a new Hawk next no where am i seeing skidpad numbers for this car so how do you know it out handles this car? you can not base a price on Prestige/longivity/build quality or else hondas would cost more then anything due to longivity and build quality. thus meaning most of your post was invaild like i said earlier. and the whole comparison you made to girls is based totaly on your opinion Which is anoter 2 or 3 sentences of invalidness galor so maybe next time you will come back with some figures to try to prove the members of the SCF wrong.<!-- Signature -->
     
  7. Just like to say I agree 100%.
     
  8. I agree too. I get so sick of these people coming into these forums and saying that nothing can beat a trans am or a viper. But you cant win against these people because its like arguing with a six year old (and i suspect that is the age of many of these people) no matter how many numbers and facts you present them with you cant change their mind and eventually resort to childish name calling. Also they dont understand the issue of when compaines like ford and bmw underate their cars and general motors overrates their car all the time. but what can you do?<!-- Signature -->
     
  9. I noticed in one of the other posts that somebody (idiot *ahem*) has compared a Pontiac (of any caliber) to an M3 and a Porsche Carrera. This guy obviously has no idea what he's talking about, and this is evident from the outset, since the specs of all 3 of these cars are further apart than his mom's legs.
    For a start, I don't claim to be a Pontiac guru, so I may be wrong, but I have a vague idea that the Trans Am Firehawk runs something in the league of an LS1 V8 (again, please correct me if I'm wrong) whereas the Porsche employs a 3.6 liter rear-mounted flat six, and the M3 draws from a front-mounted 3.2 liter straight six. I would be surprised if the power figure emanating from the Pontiac's engine wasn't higher than those of the Bimmer or Porsche, as over here in Aussie land they manage 300kW with no sweat from the LS1. This figure is obviously well above the 236kW and 252kW from the Porsche and BMW respectively, and I would dare say that the body of the Trans Am is no heavier than that of an M3...I would be surprised if it was any heavier than 1500kgs actually. Now, I know the concerned poster above would probably need to exhume Einstein's remains in a vain attempt to do the math, but we don't have 2 weeks for him to find a shovel so here's one I prepared earlier: the Pontiac has a significantly better power-weight ratio than either the Porsche or the BMW. The fact that the M3 or the Carrera aren't the fastest cars to grace the earth isn't debated at all, it's clear that any Joe can take a V8, plonk it into a Korean-quality-grade shell, and make it fly. What I would like to see is Pontiac making a hot car with an ATMO 6 CYLINDER engine, then coming back and trying to pitch it against the M3 or the Carrera. Any takers on who would win?
    The fact is that Porsche and BMW are the masters of the atmo 6 cylinders. Even BMW V8's are brilliant; let's put your beloved Firehawk against a BMW Z8 (0-60 in low 4's) and see how you go!
     
  10. Idiot! you write too much! All I have to say is both cars are badass! Yes they're are in a totally different class but if you guys could get behind the wheel of a Firehawk you'd have nothing but smiles! But yes I do agree the topic is useless!<!-- Signature -->
     
  11. Been behind the wheel of both an E46 M3 and a Corvette C5. Sure, C5 is a hard-charging weapon, as I'm sure the Firehawk is, but the feeling is hard to explain. You can feel the difference immediately when jumping from an American-built GM into a BMW, and the experience doesn't end there.
    Pity Aussie-built Monaro is only going to U.S. as Pontiac GTO with between 220 and 260kW...I think you guys would appreciate the 300kW Coupè better...what a machine! <IMG SRC="http://www.supercars.net/servlets/cMsg/html/emoticons/smile.gif">
     
  12. <!-- QUOTE --><center><hr width="90%"></center><blockquote><i>Quote from MrMetalHead82</i>
    <b>Been behind the wheel of both an E46 M3 and a Corvette C5. Sure, C5 is a hard-charging weapon, as I'm sure the Firehawk is, but the feeling is hard to explain. You can feel the difference immediately when jumping from an American-built GM into a BMW, and the experience doesn't end there.
    Pity Aussie-built Monaro is only going to U.S. as Pontiac GTO with between 220 and 260kW...I think you guys would appreciate the 300kW Coupè better...what a machine! <IMG SRC="http://www.supercars.net/servlets/cMsg/html/emoticons/smile.gif"> </b></blockquote><center><hr width="90%"></center><!-- END QUOTE -->

    Well said! <IMG SRC="http://www.supercars.net/servlets/cMsg/html/emoticons/smile.gif"><!-- Signature -->
     
  13. #13 RB26DETT, Aug 9, 2002
    Last edited by a moderator: Apr 25, 2016
  14. m3 all the way...L8rz
     
  15. <!-- QUOTE --><center><hr width="90%"></center><blockquote><i>Quote from cars r my life</i>
    <b>m3 all the way...L8rz</b></blockquote><center><hr width="90%"></center><!-- END QUOTE -->

    Stop with the f*cking L8rz shit! You do that everytime you post something you nerd! The M3 is cool but an M5 is better! However, both dont' have the raw power of an F-Body. IF you disagree with me I don't give a f*ck. I'm right your wrong! hehehehehe.
     
  16. <!-- QUOTE --><center><hr width="90%"></center><blockquote><i>Quote from KaNe</i>
    <b>Well its now clerely obvious who is the winner . . .

    The Firehawk will kick both the Carreras ass and the M3's ass</b></blockquote><center><hr width="90%"></center><!-- END QUOTE -->

    Hey Kane, did you ever figure out which Firehawk came with the special lights I mentioned over IM? Oh yeah if you want post me an email so I can get your address.
     
  17. <!-- QUOTE --><center><hr width="90%"></center><blockquote><i>Quote from KaNe</i>
    <b>Well its now clerely obvious who is the winner . . .

    The Firehawk will kick both the Carreras ass and the M3's ass</b></blockquote><center><hr width="90%"></center><!-- END QUOTE -->

    It's okay to dream of your poorly constructed firehawk beating this but it ain't gonna happen. But I bet one dream that's a nightmare for you patriotic losers is the fact that the Camaros and Firebirds are being discontinued.<!-- Signature -->
     
  18. What is everyone in this room smoking? Comparing a well built BMW M3 to a primitive firehawk? The m is faster, looks way better, and is one of the best handling cars in the world. So the question is who is dumb enough to go for the firehawk. <!-- Signature -->
     
  19. <!-- QUOTE --><center><hr width="90%"></center><blockquote><i>Quote from BMW M</i>
    <b><!-- QUOTE --><center><hr width="90%"></center><blockquote><i>Quote from KaNe</i>
    <b>Well its now clerely obvious who is the winner . . .

    The Firehawk will kick both the Carreras ass and the M3's ass</b></blockquote><center><hr width="90%"></center><!-- END QUOTE -->

    It's okay to dream of your poorly constructed firehawk beating this but it ain't gonna happen. But I bet one dream that's a nightmare for you patriotic losers is the fact that the Camaros and Firebirds are being discontinued.</b></blockquote><center><hr width="90%"></center><!-- END QUOTE -->

    I don't really like f-bodies, but you need to chill out. The Firehawk would beat your beloved m3, and for less $$$, so don't act like an ass.
     
  20. <!-- QUOTE --><center><hr width="90%"></center><blockquote><i>Quote from Hoseman</i>
    <b><!-- QUOTE --><center><hr width="90%"></center><blockquote><i>Quote from BMW M</i>
    <b><!-- QUOTE --><center><hr width="90%"></center><blockquote><i>Quote from KaNe</i>
    <b>Well its now clerely obvious who is the winner . . .

    The Firehawk will kick both the Carreras ass and the M3's ass</b></blockquote><center><hr width="90%"></center><!-- END QUOTE -->

    It's okay to dream of your poorly constructed firehawk beating this but it ain't gonna happen. But I bet one dream that's a nightmare for you patriotic losers is the fact that the Camaros and Firebirds are being discontinued.</b></blockquote><center><hr width="90%"></center><!-- END QUOTE -->

    I don't really like f-bodies, but you need to chill out. The Firehawk would beat your beloved m3, and for less $$$, so don't act like an ass.
    </b></blockquote><center><hr width="90%"></center><!-- END QUOTE -->He is correct i would luv to see what kinda of invalid arguement hes gonna make now
    <!-- Signature -->
     
  21. <!-- QUOTE --><center><hr width="90%"></center><blockquote><i>Quote from BMW M</i>
    <b><!-- QUOTE --><center><hr width="90%"></center><blockquote><i>Quote from KaNe</i>
    <b>Well its now clerely obvious who is the winner . . .

    The Firehawk will kick both the Carreras ass and the M3's ass</b></blockquote><center><hr width="90%"></center><!-- END QUOTE -->

    It's okay to dream of your poorly constructed firehawk beating this but it ain't gonna happen. But I bet one dream that's a nightmare for you patriotic losers is the fact that the Camaros and Firebirds are being discontinued.</b></blockquote><center><hr width="90%"></center><!-- END QUOTE -->HALLEJUIA!!!!! now we can only hope that the firebird/ camaro lovers will "discontinue" LOL <IMG SRC="http://www.supercars.net/servlets/cMsg/html/emoticons/smile.gif"><!-- Signature -->
     
  22. well we still need to consider the ass test. who gets more ass? teh driver of the e46 or the trans am? by ass i mean QUALITY girls, not displacement loving hicks. m3 r win.


    shit did you hear that they are changing the rulebooks because the firehawk kicks so much ass in GT events that it's unfair to other cars? HAH me neither....cuz it didnt happen.<!-- Signature -->
     
  23. i would like to add....

    "invalidness galor"

    f body drivers are perfect for their cars.

    if you want a better looking car, a better driving car, and a BETTER overall car, you need to pick the m3. i bet if you ran IQ tests for m3 drivers and compared them to the results of the same test administered to f body drivers the difference would equal the price difference<!-- Signature -->
     
  24. i would like to add....

    "invalidness galor"

    f body drivers are perfect for their cars.

    if you want a better looking car, a better driving car, and a BETTER overall car, you need to pick the m3. i bet if you ran IQ tests for m3 drivers and compared them to the results of the same test administered to f body drivers the difference would equal the price difference


    --------------------------------------------------------------------------------
    prove it.

    wow, that only makes sense since the M3 costs more, and usually IQ is directly proportionate to salary. Not to mention the fact that people who make alot of money tend to want to use it and buy 'nicer' things like BMW's. Personally, no matter how much $ I make, I would rather have the Firehawk any day. BMW's box on wheels styling is rather unbecoming and run-of-the-mill (my opinion, so don't contest it, everyone has their own opinions, and most won't change them if they are stubborn enough to post about them). Better driving? Might I ask, have you driven a Fireahawk? (I haven't and I love them, they are special production cars, and don't show up often at dealers, I've never seen one at a dealer). If you haven't, than its hard to make this claim. Handling, acceleration, etc. don't necessarily make a car more driveable. A friend of mine's toyota highlander was probably the most driveable car i've ever driven, yet it doesn't have record handling, or performance (with a 220hp V6 its not bad, bad its not fast, 4 wheel disks allow it good stopping power, but not extreme, etc). Driveability has to do with personal preference as to comfort behind the wheel, as styling has to do with personal opinion about appearance. Perhaps if you were a 'higher IQ' BMW owner, you'd know that.
     
  25. <!-- QUOTE --><center><hr width="90%"></center><blockquote><i>Quote from hsckris</i>
    <b>i would like to add....

    "invalidness galor"

    f body drivers are perfect for their cars.

    if you want a better looking car, a better driving car, and a BETTER overall car, you need to pick the m3. i bet if you ran IQ tests for m3 drivers and compared them to the results of the same test administered to f body drivers the difference would equal the price difference


    --------------------------------------------------------------------------------
    prove it.

    wow, that only makes sense since the M3 costs more, and usually IQ is directly proportionate to salary. Not to mention the fact that people who make alot of money tend to want to use it and buy 'nicer' things like BMW's. Personally, no matter how much $ I make, I would rather have the Firehawk any day. BMW's box on wheels styling is rather unbecoming and run-of-the-mill (my opinion, so don't contest it, everyone has their own opinions, and most won't change them if they are stubborn enough to post about them). Better driving? Might I ask, have you driven a Fireahawk? (I haven't and I love them, they are special production cars, and don't show up often at dealers, I've never seen one at a dealer). If you haven't, than its hard to make this claim. Handling, acceleration, etc. don't necessarily make a car more driveable. A friend of mine's toyota highlander was probably the most driveable car i've ever driven, yet it doesn't have record handling, or performance (with a 220hp V6 its not bad, bad its not fast, 4 wheel disks allow it good stopping power, but not extreme, etc). Driveability has to do with personal preference as to comfort behind the wheel, as styling has to do with personal opinion about appearance. Perhaps if you were a 'higher IQ' BMW owner, you'd know that. </b></blockquote><center><hr width="90%"></center><!-- END QUOTE -->

    So let me get this straight, you think that a Firehawk is better simply because "YOU" think it looks better. That's the lamest argument I've ever heard. And if a car has good handling it doesn't make it more drivable? Um, the 2 are complementary to eachother so I don't know what you've been smoking. The M3 is known to be one of the best handling cars in the world and it's no coincidence that it's one of the most drivable in "all weather conditions" (Road and Track magazine).<!-- Signature -->
     

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