Re: 57.57 bhp per litre, that sux a**

Discussion in '2002 Dodge Viper GTS Final Edition' started by Corvettewillkillyou, Aug 9, 2002.

  1. 57.57 bhp per litre, that sux a**

    it only has 57.57 bhp per litre, and I bet its handling hasnt gone up
     
  2. hahahaha...another kid thinking hp/l means something in performance

    i have said it once i will say it again hp/l doesnt mean crap in performance aspects if it did let me know this

    why doesnt the s2000 911turbo f355 and the cars of that like the Integra type r or other cars like that, that push 100bhp/l or more, but cant beat the viper????? becuz hp/l doesnt mean crap.

    dont think so? still think hp/l matters?

    bring it on, i will tear u apart, and make u wish u knew something about cars.

    hahahaha another guy who has a small engine and wants to feell good about himself...bwtf my econo car has more hp/l than this is it better or faster? fck no it aint, not even close, well a little close becuz of the mods, but thats another story.

    i feel for the people that think hp/l means something in performance.<!-- Signature -->
     
  3. supras are mildly turboed, but get worse gas performance than the z06....whats ur point ur trying to make?<!-- Signature -->
     
  4. <!-- Signature -->
     
  5. no car is ever built just to compete there but they will sure as hell run it there just to see what they can do it in. and i believe i know what i said so dont repost it moron they can scroll up and see if it they want. and my truck gets 16mpg but i had to pay no gas guzzler tax of 3000 like you do for a viper, hence the bs flag. <!-- Signature -->
     
  6. its piece of crap, nice engine though.<!-- Signature -->
     
  7. <!-- QUOTE --><center><hr width="90%"></center><blockquote><i>Quote from PreludePower</i>
    <b>ZX-2 0-60 in 7.4 - 8.0 sec
    RSX Type S 0-60 in 6.2 - 6.5

    If the math is done, that does not seem to be even just like you said. RSX S is over a second faster. If the ZX2 POS was truly that fast I would see more on the road. </b></blockquote><center><hr width="90%"></center><!-- END QUOTE -->

    funny thats the normal zx2...with 130bhp and 127lbs-ft

    but i was comparing the type-s to a s/r

    only 2000 s/r were made..and delivered to svt dealers only...some ford dealers dont even know it exists it was such a sudden thing if u will.

    it came with a 1,500 dollar package upgrade...which bumped the hp to 155 and the torque to 145.

    the type-s is actually only 6.8sec when tested by magazines...but my s/r has never been tested by a mag...and my testing of 0-60 was 6.9secs...and the type-s pulls 15.1 in the 1/4....while i have pulled 15.2 in the 1/4 at mile high altitude.

    so yes my comparison was right....but u keep telling urself thats the 11k+ zx2, the s/r is 14k.<!-- Signature -->
     
  8. Why don't the dipshits who just blurt out nonsense read the entire thread before making a comment? Most of the people who have had something worthwhile to say actualy did a little research and stated the facts and then some idiot comes along and tries to make them look stupid with biased dipshit opinion. And can anyone give a valid reason the viper sucks or is crap or shit etc. ??? Go look at my question on the topspeed thread with the ferrari f50 gt asking what will win ferrari,clk,mclaren etc.. All these idiots said the viper sucked but had nothing to back it up and when I asked no one answered. Whoever says a car sucks without a valid point is just an insecure pussy. Please someone answer my question with valid thoughtful reasons. It all amounts to biased opinion. (Oh no an american car is starting to dominate races and it has a huge 8 liter. Big engines and american cars suck.) What kind of reasoning is that?
    The viper has proved itself time and time again so all you fools who say a very competive car sucks are realy the ones who suck with your closed mindedness.
     
  9. HP/L means a lot, but not on big ass engines like these, they mean a lot in Hondas, and Porsches, small engines which have to rev high, this car doesnt need a lot of HP/l because is 8 Liters big, the same amount of liquid I drink in a week. This car might not handle that well, but it is beautiful.<!-- Signature -->
     
  10. Its almost as if the people saying that the Viper sucks in handling have no knowledge of the car at all. The Viper makes over 1g of Lateral acceleration and passes through the slalom at over 70mph.

    The Viper is easily one of the best handling cars in the world. If you want proof, just take a peek through just about every automotive magazine or car comparison and you'll find that what I'm saying is absolutely true.<!-- Signature -->
     
  11. Here's one (more on the way).
     
  12. EliteWolverine's comment clarified (for those of you who missed it).
     
  13. Awesome stuff Guibo. FerrariF60, time and time again you've blatently displayed your ignorance and idiocy. HP buys cars, but torque wins races. Power is a function of mass, distance and time. The exact equation is (md^2)/t^3. The more power a car makes, the better rate of force it provides, and thus the greater acceleration, but if that power can't be applied to the road, it's useless. THAT'S where torque comes in, and tires of course. As for regulations on power, there is a limit to how much power a road driven car can legally make, but I can't remember what it was. I'm sure though that 500 is just scraping the surface of illegal power. This car is awesome. It's the epitome of sports cars in that it displays all the characteristics of a true sports car without following any of the cliques that society places on it. It's as subtle as a sledgehammer with an attitude to match. If you're a panzy and can't handle the skilled, on-the-edge power, drive a NSX, but if you want the challenge of burning 335 series tires, the Viper is your way to go.
     
  14. You got it right there. This car is sweet, anyone who tries to deny it obviously doesn't know much.
     
  15. <!-- QUOTE --><center><hr width="90%"></center><blockquote><i>Quote from Ferrari F60</i>
    <b><!-- QUOTE --><center><hr width="90%"></center><blockquote><i>Quote from Mark</i>
    <b><!-- QUOTE --><center><hr width="90%"></center><blockquote><i>Quote from EliteWolverine</i>
    <b><!-- QUOTE --><center><hr width="90%"></center><blockquote><i>Quote from Ferrari F60</i>
    <b>the guy is rite, this car is still very underpowered. and it's handling still sux and it still doesn't have ABS!</b></blockquote><center><hr width="90%"></center><!-- END QUOTE -->

    and that statement shows how much u know about cars...absolutely nothing.</b></blockquote><center><hr width="90%"></center><!-- END QUOTE -->

    Yeah the guy from the first quote is just a moron, and about the horsepower issue. The average driver can not even handle this thing. It comes to a point where they are selling a loaded gun to a monkey. These things can be very lethal in the wrong hands. I like the idea of buying the car myself at a good price (for what you get) and tuning it to my abilities.</b></blockquote><center><hr width="90%"></center><!-- END QUOTE -->
    The average driver can't handle this car because it needs help of elecronics to get better traction and handling, that is the problem with U.S. cars, they are so low tech. I own a tuned '99 porsche 911, i have an added twin turbo in there and if i want to loose control of it then i have to turn off all the elecronics which the viper doesn't have. my car beats all vipers.</b></blockquote><center><hr width="90%"></center><!-- END QUOTE -->

    Oh yay, another 12 year old kid who thinks he knows something about cars from playing Gran Turismo. The average driving can't handle a viper eh? My grandpa's 95' RT/10 had no trouble behaving in city driving conditions. The car did get a little squirly when I floored it to pass a slow Cadillac on the freeway but it never felt out of control.

    It surprises me that someone with such limited grammar skills could get a job that pays well enough for you to own a 99' Porsche.

    I never thought I would hear someone say that the Viper is "very underpowered". How retarded are you!? Are you expecting 800 horsepower from a $90,000 front engine road car or something? The Viper is definetly a world class sports car. Anyone who says otherwise is an idiot.
     
  16. SilverFenix , So you don't like the viper eh? 57.57 hp/l aint enough when it is an 8.0L engine??? Buddy, I bet you wouldn;t have the balls to drive a car that had 100hp/l if it was a 8L engine. An engine like that makes the care feel difrent, the way it pulls you and the noise irt makes, some peopel liek that, its called Diversity.
     
  17. what a tard. gimme a fuggin break. hp/l in a viper thread.<!-- Signature -->
     
  18. <!-- QUOTE --><center><hr width="90%"></center><blockquote><i>Quote from SilverFenix</i>
    <b>it only has 57.57 bhp per litre, and I bet its handling hasnt gone up</b></blockquote><center><hr width="90%"></center><!-- END QUOTE -->

    That makes the engine very reliable , and everybody knows the engine can be pushed much higher in terms of HP.
     
  19. It doesnt matter that much about HP/Liter if it gets the job done and is fast....and we all know the Viper is FAST!! It goes crazy fast in a straight line, and is a serious road race car that handles as well.
    Its hard to argue with sucess like the Viper.

    But saying that engines with more HP per liter are more unreliable is totally off. Thats not true at all. Look at the reliabilty of Toyota and.....yuck Honda.....they are EXTREAMLY reliable. A Toyota Supras engine for instance is extremly stout and very reliable, as are so many others.
    Having more HP in an engine whos internals are not up to the task is unreliable. However, if the pieces are properly engineered, like the block, rods, pistons, ect....then the engine will be strong enough to reliably handle that power.

    Im not getting into a debate about which is better...AT ALL. Just saying that the comment about less efficiant engines being more reliable is alittle missleading.

    But the Viper has a large engine, and when compared to some, it is relativly ineficiant in terms of HP/L However, the Viper is as fast as they come, and is faster than most cars with more efficiant engines. And it combines it in a package that handles and goes in a strait line. So, if it works, why knock it?
     
  20. what ppl need 2 start doing, is saying WHY hp/L is irrelevant, rather than just 'my big fat american engine has more power than your little jap engine so its better'

    so, here goes.....power is work done over time, there4 it is not a measurable quantity, rather it is calculated from the torque the car produces, which is work done pushing the pistons down the cylinders (force of explosion multiplied by distance away from centre of rotation)

    so to make high power, all u need is lots of revs (Honda S2000)....but making torque is the real challenge, torque depends on 3 things, absolute boost pressure (14.5psi if NA), compression ratio, and displacement

    the best engines r those that can get high torque from, say, an average comp ratio of 10.5:1, so for a random example....a Z06 which gets 70.6 lbft/L is not as good an engine as the CLK-GTR which gets 83 lbft/L (admittedly almost a race-spec engine) from the same comp/boost....the 'per litre' accounts for the Mercs bigger (6.9-litre V12) engine

    no doubt ppl will say its not that simple and try and make it more difficult 2 understand, however, this (slightly) simplified explanation works well for the non-engine-designers among us
     
  21. So what, for holy torque Batman!
     
  22. Hp/L doesn't matter alone; it's just a ratio. What DOES matter is what the product of that ratio and the displacement is (i.e., nominal output). Hp/L is a decent measurement of how well an engine is designed, but other factors do have to be taken into account, expecially overall engine size. It is much, much more difficult to make an engine with 8L displacement put out 120hp/L NA than it is to make a 2L engine put out that same ratio. That's because the parts for the engine are so large and heavy, so much more of the power is wasted doing internal work. That's why Formula 1 engines have so many cylinders for such a small displacement, and it also explains why whey have so much power.

    That said, I still think the Viper is a piece of shit. There is nothing more disgusting to me than this car; it is the embodiment of gluttony. Anyone who needs 8L to make a car move at 3.6L Ferrari speeds shouldn't be designing cars. I would take the Z06 over a Viper any day of the week, even if each was offered for free.

    I hope that the GT40 puts the Viper out of production.<!-- Signature -->
     
  23. torque is not challenge at all...long stroke coupled with big displacement=lots of torque...maybe not hp but torque.

    Now the real challenge is to get a engine get equal amounts of hp with equal amounts of torque at a relatively high rpm 6000 or so.

    take the idea of american cars...our hp/l isnt alot but we make up for it in lb-ft...maybe not in lb-ft/l but its still good.

    Take this viper for a reason of topic..it makes 460bhp@5200rpm and 490lb-ft.

    now its hp is low if u will for a big displacement engine, but look where the rpm is at for that hp.

    Many people seem to forget that high reving engines are small, becuz a long stroke(long piston rods), cant rev really really high becuz it will twist punch a whole throught the piston, break in two, and so forth. so making lots of torque while making lots of hp at high rpm is very hard and very expensive.

    comparing a race spec engine like the clk-gtr to the z06 is not the way to get the point across about better engines, becuz common sense would lean to telling u that a 50k engine should be better than a 50k car...

    now back to the engines a good show of how hp/l doesnt mean anything is this one.
    rsx type-s vs. zx2 s/r
    rsx 200bhp@7600rpm 142lb-ft@5600rpm
    zx2 155bhp@5600rpm 145lb-ft@4500rpm

    the zx2 has less hp becuz of the lower rpm range, but counters it with the same amount of torque as the rsx...and the result is the exact same performance numbers...gears weight and everything else is negliable becuz the fact that these two cars almost weigh the same, gearing is 2-3mph difference at most.

    hp/l is neglected in this sence and since the zx2 matches the rsx in torque it is able to pull the same numbers from 0-60 0-100 1/4mile and so forth.

    proving once again that hp/l doesnt mean crap about the cars/engines performance.

    but a good engine/great engine, makes great hp great torque and great rpms (6k-8k rpm).

    now comparing hp(power) and torque(work) to the internal size of the engine...is like saying how much work/power is contained in this certain amount of space...or how many punches can u through at a bag in a certain size of training room....power/size is a stupid ratio and made up for people who want to feel good about a performance lacking engine...if u will.

    enough said, ur lania delta sucks if u think this viper sucks...anyone wanting to go that fast on gravel is stupid...lol

    viper sucks...hehe your funny, anyone needing to use a turbo on a engine obviously cant make engine right the first time...

    see where its getting to...thinking the viper sucks to use a big engine to get outragous power at such a low cost is something u have to coupe with...and for the fact that the cheapest ferrari is 145k that falls to the vipers supremesy big time...then ferrari needs to get some help in making cars and learn something from american tech<!-- Signature -->
     
  24. What matters is what the car delivers. This car delivers plenty. It can be a good handler, ask thse who race it. No it is not a great handler of the showroom (though underestimated greatly) it is decent. For 70K This car is an evolution of cheap HP. Try to beat the power numbers of this car for 70K without aftermarket and in an import. It is not easy. The US cars are great for cheap HP and performance. End of story. Rant about Hp/l all you want, the car does what it does for the price it is, and that is impressive.
    Then people go and say oh it is so inefficient and all...well the Z06 gets the same milage as the S2000 and the GT2 gets gas milage like a domestic truck, so that argument is inconsistent if you are bashing big blocks. This car is inefficent, so what? No one with a 70K vehicle wories about their gas bill anyway.
    So it is a matter of taste, not practicality, so if you don't like the Viper, fine. But it is not trash because of an argument that is only relevant when comparing engines of the same size. The whle HP/l argument is pretty meaningless here. <!-- Signature -->
     
  25. I totally agree with SpareTire...Except the part about beating the performance for 70k...The Z06 is right with it in every catergory and is 50k. It also makes 50 less hp...But Vipers are great cars, anyone who thinks they aren't obviously knows nothing of cars...I think Dodge just detunes the car so it has less power...I have seen 800hp Vipers with not many mods... So you jap geeks can just back off the Vipers case because you cant touch it <IMG SRC="http://www.supercars.net/servlets/cMsg/html/emoticons/smile.gif">
     

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