Re: *sigh* Americans...

Discussion in '2002 Porsche 911 GT2' started by Josh427, Aug 10, 2002.

  1. <!-- QUOTE --><center><hr width="90%"></center><blockquote><i>Quote from hsckris</i>
    <b>the GT2 is not faster than the vette, porsches website has the list time at 4.1 seconds to 60, supercars.net has it at 4 flat, the Z06 posts 4 flat to 60 as well. To 60 is the only thing that really matters, b/c thats where you win street races. Sure driveability is an issue, but these cars are so close to 60 that its quite sad for porsche condisering they charge over 100,000$ more for the GT2 (vette z06- 50,000$, porche gt2- 179,000$). If you put the extra 100 grand into the vette, the vette would eat the GT2 so bad it wouldn't even be funny, but the funniest thing to me is that you don't have to, the vette will already run with the GT2 in the numbers. I'm sorry if you paid too much for your porsche, GO ZO6!!!</b></blockquote><center><hr width="90%"></center><!-- END QUOTE -->

    Z06's (405h) do run 4 flats to 60mph which is blazing. Dont forget that Porsche usually downplays their #'s and the GT2 has run consistently at 3.6 (R&T, C&C) so if "To 60 is the only thing that really matters", the Z06 is slower. A more realistic measure of speed would be on the strip. Im interested to see if anyone has times for these machines. As far as price, consider some of the high tech materials on the GT2 such as the braking system which alone costs a pretty penny. <!-- Signature -->
     
  2. <!-- QUOTE --><center><hr width="90%"></center><blockquote><i>Quote from Ferrari4ever123</i>
    <b>why dont americans export becuase noone wants their crap



    yes the peice of shit 1950 technology pushrod engine would cost alot more in over head cam form......but americans are lazy......
    plus they dont have enough tech to make a overhead cam engine(not literally.)</b></blockquote><center><hr width="90%"></center><!-- END QUOTE -->
    Where are you from?<!-- Signature -->
     
  3. Re: *sigh* Americans...What is this guy talkin bout

    I have to say, that the prosche 911 GT2 is a great car.....but so is the chevy Corvette Z06. The difference is that prosche is trying to sell their name, but the corvette is a true supercar through and through. I'll tell you what, I'll eat my hat, if porsche can one day come up with a car as good as the corvette, that is about the same price as the CORVETTE. There's nothing so special about the prosche that would make it extremely better than the corvette.....come on off your high pedistel.!!!
     
  4. Re: *sigh* Americans...What is this guy talkin bout

    <!-- QUOTE --><center><hr width="90%"></center><blockquote><i>Quote from PanozGTR</i>
    <b> I have to say, that the prosche 911 GT2 is a great car.....but so is the chevy Corvette Z06. The difference is that prosche is trying to sell their name, but the corvette is a true supercar through and through. I'll tell you what, I'll eat my hat, if porsche can one day come up with a car as good as the corvette, that is about the same price as the CORVETTE. There's nothing so special about the prosche that would make it extremely better than the corvette.....come on off your high pedistel.!!!</b></blockquote><center><hr width="90%"></center><!-- END QUOTE -->

    Yes they are BOTH great cars, but I dont think Porsche is just selling their name on a bland car. This machine has some SERIOUS performance. The technology and performance alone make the GT2 every bit the supercar the Z06 is, if not more. Porsche isnt in a price war w/ chevy. This machine is expensive, the brakes alone are roughly 1/5 the price of a ZO6, its produced in limited #'s, and drivers are buying them. If you were porsche management why would you reduce the prices of your machines when they're selling well above their msrp's?. These are both two wonderful machines, but the price disparity has become too much of an issue. Cheaper does not = better and vice versa. <!-- Signature -->
     
  5. <!-- QUOTE --><center><hr width="90%"></center><blockquote><i>Quote from mpg</i>
    <b><!-- QUOTE --><center><hr width="90%"></center><blockquote><i>Quote from Turbo FREAK</i>
    <b>if you are a supercar buyer then you wouldnt care about how much the GT2 or vette costs unless you cant offord them or you can barely get the money to get a vette then I can see why you would say a vette is better then a ZO6 but literally a GT2 can go around the ZO6 in circles on the road. I cant believe you guys are comparing a ZO6 to a GT2. You vette dudes go to every forum and say "oh this sux and the vette is better" I like the vette but you guys are talking shit all the tie trying to even compare them. WHo #$%#ing cares how much the vette costs??!!!! just because it's american and youguys are american doesnt mean you have to defend it with all your life! grow up..</b></blockquote><center><hr width="90%"></center><!-- END QUOTE -->
    You don't have to be American to like the Z06. Maybe most aren't American. Maybe they prefer it for other reasons.</b></blockquote><center><hr width="90%"></center><!-- END QUOTE -->

    Uhh dude, down here in Australia (oh, you may laugh) the engine which powers the Z06 is all the rage in Holden vehicles (Holden = Australian GM.) And it's not all that crash-hot, sonny Jim...
     
  6. <!-- QUOTE --><center><hr width="90%"></center><blockquote><i>Quote from MrMetalHead82</i>
    <b><!-- QUOTE --><center><hr width="90%"></center><blockquote><i>Quote from mpg</i>
    <b><!-- QUOTE --><center><hr width="90%"></center><blockquote><i>Quote from Turbo FREAK</i>
    <b>if you are a supercar buyer then you wouldnt care about how much the GT2 or vette costs unless you cant offord them or you can barely get the money to get a vette then I can see why you would say a vette is better then a ZO6 but literally a GT2 can go around the ZO6 in circles on the road. I cant believe you guys are comparing a ZO6 to a GT2. You vette dudes go to every forum and say "oh this sux and the vette is better" I like the vette but you guys are talking shit all the tie trying to even compare them. WHo #$%#ing cares how much the vette costs??!!!! just because it's american and youguys are american doesnt mean you have to defend it with all your life! grow up..</b></blockquote><center><hr width="90%"></center><!-- END QUOTE -->
    You don't have to be American to like the Z06. Maybe most aren't American. Maybe they prefer it for other reasons.</b></blockquote><center><hr width="90%"></center><!-- END QUOTE -->

    Uhh dude, down here in Australia (oh, you may laugh) the engine which powers the Z06 is all the rage in Holden vehicles (Holden = Australian GM.) And it's not all that crash-hot, sonny Jim...</b></blockquote><center><hr width="90%"></center><!-- END QUOTE -->
    Sorry, I don't speak Australian. What does that mean?<!-- Signature -->
     
  7. Yeah lets not talk about ALL Americans.<!-- Signature -->
     
  8. <!-- QUOTE --><center><hr width="90%"></center><blockquote><i>Quote from Lingenfelter</i>
    <b><!-- QUOTE --><center><hr width="90%"></center><blockquote><i>Quote from 911Gt2</i>
    <b>Fu*k the Vett its a shitt*y car. American cars are sh*t. German car best cars ever made!</b></blockquote><center><hr width="90%"></center><!-- END QUOTE -->
    Ummm you should get your head out of your ass lets go back umm to the 60's and 70's when Caddy was King or when the American's had there Big Blocks and Big power where was BMW,BENZ,FERRARI, and all them then they didn't dare come out to race the Big American Cars</b></blockquote><center><hr width="90%"></center><!-- END QUOTE -->

    Yea Benz and Ferrari just won almost all the grand prix and le mans races in the era(xept for the ones that GT40 won <IMG SRC="http://www.supercars.net/servlets/cMsg/html/emoticons/smile.gif"> ), benz had the land speed record. Remember 300SLR from 50's? 100 hp/liter hello? Why did James Dean drive a Porche speedster and not a Dodge Dart? Hello?? Why do americans with MONEY buy Euro cars and not domestic??? Get my point?

    And NO, Caddy was NOT king i Europe or any other place.<!-- Signature -->
     
  9. How about this, lets talk numbers. According to the same source: Motortrend. But first of all we need to clear up a few things, your 911 GT2 is an upgrade, it is a souped up 911 turbo. If you compare a 911 turbo to a regular vette, it is slightly slower, but a viper is slightly faster. If you compare the souped up versions of all 3 though, porsche has got some problems.
    0-60: Venom 800tt: 2.4
    Ligenfelter Vette 8.0: 1.97
    911 GT2: 3.8
    1/4 mile:
    Venom 800tt:10.0
    Ligenfelter Vette 8.0: 9.24
    911 GT2: 12.1

    Case closed. Americans must have some bigger guns than you thought.


     
  10. Re-Open that case:
    The GT2 is souped up, but thats not the point... its still a FACTORY ORIGINAL and not the product of a tuner. 3.6 is a great # for machine built in house. Sure a 800tt may run a 2.4 60, but what good is that when the car is on fire right after that run??? The point is that many hyper tuned tanks blow up (especially hennessy vipers) and suffer from endless complications. Thats why they're not compared to "real" cars. Sure your 7.0 liter TT vette runs blazing sub 2secs to 60 (on slicks) , but go buy one and drive it around for a year and then post your matinence and repair costs for everyone to chuckle at. Thats why the Z06 is so respected, in house machine that runs w/ all the Euro big-boys. You can go for a beer run, smoke a ricer, take your wife out to dinner, and park it safely without it catching on fire at any point in the evening. Its real.<!-- Signature -->
     
  11. <!-- QUOTE --><center><hr width="90%"></center><blockquote><i>Quote from TechNspeed</i>
    <b>Re-Open that case:
    The GT2 is souped up, but thats not the point... its still a FACTORY ORIGINAL and not the product of a tuner. 3.6 is a great # for machine built in house. Sure a 800tt may run a 2.4 60, but what good is that when the car is on fire right after that run??? The point is that many hyper tuned tanks blow up (especially hennessy vipers) and suffer from endless complications. Thats why they're not compared to "real" cars. Sure your 7.0 liter TT vette runs blazing sub 2secs to 60 (on slicks) , but go buy one and drive it around for a year and then post your matinence and repair costs for everyone to chuckle at. Thats why the Z06 is so respected, in house machine that runs w/ all the Euro big-boys. You can go for a beer run, smoke a ricer, take your wife out to dinner, and park it safely without it catching on fire at any point in the evening. Its real.</b></blockquote><center><hr width="90%"></center><!-- END QUOTE -->lol. Beer run? <!-- Signature -->
     
  12. I find it sad that Europeans and the rest of the world constantly looks down on Americans. If you don't like American cars, fine, that's your opinion. That's no reason to generalize American people, though. Sure some of us are thick-headed rednecks, however, that doesn't mean all of us are. It really angers me how many Europeans constantly joke about how stupid Americans are. I've been to Europe many times and all I can say is that many of the people there are just as stupid as the people here. Every place has their intellectuals and morons. I agree with the notion that Europe produces cars with more quality, luxury, and performance. I've been to every continent in the world (except for Antarctica) and I can tell you that the best place to live is right here in the U.S.A. If you still think Americans are stupid, then stop trying to be like us. Stop watching our movies, stop copying our fashion, stop mimicing our government, stop mimicing our currency, and ignore the fact that Europe may be a third world continent right now if it weren't for U.S. involvement in World War 2 and the Marshall Plan. I'm a big fan of European cars; not the heavy amount of Europe's thickheaded people.<!-- Signature -->
     
  13. <!-- QUOTE --><center><hr width="90%"></center><blockquote><i>Quote from Stuttgart</i>
    <b>I find it sad that Europeans and the rest of the world constantly looks down on Americans. If you don't like American cars, fine, that's your opinion. That's no reason to generalize American people, though. Sure some of us are thick-headed rednecks, however, that doesn't mean all of us are. It really angers me how many Europeans constantly joke about how stupid Americans are. I've been to Europe many times and all I can say is that many of the people there are just as stupid as the people here. Every place has their intellectuals and morons. I agree with the notion that Europe produces cars with more quality, luxury, and performance. I've been to every continent in the world (except for Antarctica) and I can tell you that the best place to live is right here in the U.S.A. If you still think Americans are stupid, then stop trying to be like us. Stop watching our movies, stop copying our fashion, stop mimicing our government, stop mimicing our currency, and ignore the fact that Europe may be a third world continent right now if it weren't for U.S. involvement in World War 2 and the Marshall Plan. I'm a big fan of European cars; not the heavy amount of Europe's thickheaded people.</b></blockquote><center><hr width="90%"></center><!-- END QUOTE -->Same here. I too live in America (Houston, TX to be more specific) and I don't like people saying how all Americans are thick headed red necks. Some of them are but there others. European people? No offense but I had encounters with them and they are worse then people here in the United States. European cars? Best cars there are. I like the way you put how most these countries are copying us and trying to be just like Americans. <!-- Signature -->
     
  14. You are a moron or just misinformed. The new GT40, that's right new, will come out with better performance than this. Now that would be a better match for the 911 GT2. Considering though that the new GT40 hasn't come out though it's just hypothetical.

    Can anyone see who will make the better sports car for the money then?
     
  15. <!-- QUOTE --><center><hr width="90%"></center><blockquote><i>Quote from Lord Lucan</i>
    <b><!-- QUOTE --><center><hr width="90%"></center><blockquote><i>Quote from Josh6474</i>
    <b>Well for one thing the Corvette is a damn good sports car, no matter how much you guys hate large displacement V8's, the Z06 is one of the best performers doller for doller you will find anywhere. You have to respect the cheap speed of some American cars.

    That said, I would like to turn to the comment, "American cars just can't keep up with Europeans". Well, have you heard of a car called the GT40? It happens to be a extremely fast car, capable of wasting ferraris(with the exception of the F50, but come on, its 650 grand more expensive than the GT40, and even then, the GT40 isn't that far behind it) and porsches on the strip and on the track. Just try and get your facts straight guys.

    Anyways, this porsche is one hell of a car. Very nice, looks good. Porsche is one of the best car makers ever.</b></blockquote><center><hr width="90%"></center><!-- END QUOTE -->
    Great idea-compare a supercar from the 60's to one from the 90's and cite price as the older car's advantage. Smart.</b></blockquote><center><hr width="90%"></center><!-- END QUOTE -->You are a moron or just misinformed. The new GT40, that's right new, will come out with better performance than this. Now that would be a better match for the 911 GT2. Considering though that the new GT40 hasn't come out though it's just hypothetical.

    Can anyone see who will make the better sports car for the money then?
     
  16. That was very Canadien.

    Bravo
     
  17. Bravo again.

    I not knocking you but those comments in that one post were good and bad.

    <!-- Signature -->
     
  18. wow that was one big, deep essay...but how does it have to do with a Porsche??
     
  19. GT40 can't compare to a GT2
     
  20. Seriously, a GT40 aint got nothin on the GT2
     
  21. I think this is the smartest thing I've ever seen you post on this website.
     
  22. I'm an American and I can admit that what MWB said about our government is mostly if not totally correct. But I think he knows that not all Americans agree with what our government does. I know several people who know the truth of what's going on, but the majority do not, simply because they are not exposed to the truth.

    Now, back to this car comparison. Somebody mentioned that you get what you pay for. That's the case between the zo6 and the gt2. Almost everybody agrees that the gt2 will beat this car from 0-60 and in the quarter mile. But what is not brought up is the amount of testing the porsche goes through. Porsche sets out not only to create a car that's fast and agile, but one that can perform under any weather conditions. Their cars are taken to to places ranging from deserts to ice cold mountain roads. The gt2 is a great all around car made to be a champion in all weather conditions.

    What interests me more than 0-60 is lap times. That's where the gt2 will shine in comparison. After all, do you suddenly release the gas pedal when you get to 60? Will you always be starting at zero? Hell no. I don't care if oppositions has more HP, Torque, can pull more G's.... none of that matters unless it can get you a better lap time. It takes a hell of a lot more engineering genious to make a car get a great time on a track than go quickly in a straight line. So much more comes into play.

    About the price difference. The price difference between the two cars is less than most people think if you compare how much the cars cost in their own respective countries. And NO, if you pour the left-over money into the corvette you will not have a better car than the gt2. You will probably have a car that will accellerate more quickly than the gt2 BUT unless it translates to beating it on a track, I don't care. SHOW ME LAP TIMES. And to the people who keep complaining about the amount of extra money you have to pay for the gt2 for the "small" performance increase not being worthwhile, I guess that depends on if you like WINNING?? I dunno, in my experience some people like to win. Even a difference of .1 seconds means everything. And maybe some of you don't know this, but it takes more and more money to increase performance in a car. It's not as simple as "If I throw 60K into that car instead of 30K it will perform TWICE as well!" NO. As performance goes up, the price goes up exponentially. Look up the word if you don't know what it means.

    I agree that the GT2 follows a certain design to uphold tradition. I also agree that it's probably not the best design. But the fact is that even having the limitations of having to follow these guidelines, porsche manages to create marvels of engineering capable of beating the pants off of so many supercars. That a 3.6L engine can overcome the big hulking corvette engine is amazing. Some of you said the gt2 engine isn't very technologically advanced due to poorer gas mileage than the vette. It has everything to do with what conditions you are measuring the mileage at. Cruising around on a highway the corvette wins, but what about during hard acceleration? I honestly don't know the figures but I'm just saying that if we are comparing the performance of these cars we may as well compare gas mileage DURING perormance. One of the reasons the porsche can handle better than the corvette is because of the smaller/lighter engine. Porsche is willing to sacrifice some gas mileage for performance.

    I think the performance figures of the corvette are great when looking at the cost of the vehicle, but it doesn't come near the overall performance and styling of the gt2. Both cars are great, the gt2 is better, that's why you pay more.

    And that's my two cents.
     
  23. ok billy didn't have to write a 16 page essay on the damn thing
     
  24. Your name is Billy?
     
  25. Nope, Ian since birth.
     

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