"if WR has good race results he will also be fast on a time attack." Wait a minute. Where did I say he would *not* be fast on a time attack? I would like for you to show me *where* I ever said (or even implied) that he would be slow. This is the second post now where you seem to think I feel WR is a slow driver, when I haven't said a single thing to that effect. Show me where I said it. "when Stuck was racing,WR was developing porsches on the Nurburgring....think,use your brain.ok...orsches-Sport Auto-lap times....." And when WR was developing Porsches on the Nurburgring, Stuck was racing and developing BMW's on the Nurburgring (and at other tracks as well). He even managed to get his name to a 1-2 finish in the 24H Rennen some years back, didn't he? Are you trying to tell me that von Saurma has more experience behind the wheels of BMW's than Stuck? "you want me to know every lap time that Stuck and WR did in theirs carreers by heart??????" Did I ask for that????? No. I asked a simple question, as it relates to street cars in this thread: When's the last time these two went head to head in the same production car under identical conditions? If you don't know, just say it. You don't need to ramble on pointlessly about some races they took part in a decade and a half ago. "top gear track has bigger straights and technicaly it looks easy.just look at the lap times of the celebrity guests." I suppose little cars like the Cayman S and Lotus Exige took advantage of the big straights and lack of technical difficulty to beat cars like the Corvette and Viper (by 2+ seconds), while at the HRing, they are actually slower than those two cars, huh? Looking at the celebrity lap times is pretty pointless. What happens when you overcook a corner in that econo sedan? You get some understeer, you might get two wheels off the ground if you're incredibly sloppy with your line. And celebrity motorheads like Jay Kay and Jodie Kidd should be futher up the chart, but curiously they're not. You can't really draw any conclusions from celebrity lap times. If the track is easy, Ellen MacArthur in a CGT should set a lap time on a par with the Stig. Do you think that's likely? "Sport Auot weighs their cars with the tank full and no driver or luggage. Sport auto measured a difference of 80kg between the M5 and M6." And Sport Auto found that the M6 weighed less than BMW claimed. Who's lying? I could swear that Porsche weighed the CGT (at 1380 kg) under the DIN standard. Is that not the case? In any event, Porsche has updated the CGT's weight at its site in accordance with the EU standard: http://www.porsche.com/germany/models/carrera-gt/modelinformation/technicalspecifications/ And yup, it's +68 kg (for driver) and +7 kg (for luggage) for a grand total of 1455 kg as expected. However, Sport Auto weighed the CGT at 1475 kg in their Supertest. That's without driver, without luggage, and 90% fuel, yet it weighs 20 kg *more* than Porsche claims the CGT weighs with a driver, full tank, and 7kg's of luggage?? That's an even greater discrepancy than between Sport Auto and BMW weights. Yet, why don't you call Porsche "liars" for not listing the correct weight of the CGT? "the carbon fiber roof doesn't explain a difference of 20,000 euros.also the 6 doesn't have any particular parts that aren't in other BMWs(except of course for the body." Whoa, where did I say the fiber roof alone explains the difference of 20,000 Euros? I never did. I put it as *one* possible explanation after the production aspect for a reason. From the BMW press release, there are other areas that were lightened: "A tour around the car reveals weight-saving on every plane, including the worlds first carbon fibre (CFP) roof in series production, CFP front and rear bumper supports, aluminium doors and bonnet, thermoplastic front wings and a sheet moulding compound (SMC) boot lid." Apparently the rear window is also thinner and lighter, there are different (lighter) wheels, and can you even get a full leather dash and leather central shifter console in the standard 6? And the body is still a very important (some would say the single most important) part of a car, so of course there will be expense in building it. They also had to make modifications to the body to accept he new engine and roof. BMW will obviously pass some of the cost of development onto the consumer.