This beauty had a Lotus designed engine. I was DOHC, 4 vpc. That technology makes cars expensive, but it is good that GM took the desition of improving once more their pushrods because they were really eating shit!!! The Z06 is my dream corvette, it is a pushrod and it has the same hp/liter of this one being DOHC. Pushrods use technology from the late 40's, so that is why they are so cheap. I would like to see Chrysler build a competitor for the Z06. That Viper sucks.. come on, it is like puting a 10,000 pound truck engine into an old Toyota Celica. Only displacement, no technology or improvement. Chrysler could bring back their Hemi's and get 400hp out of a 5.7L. I love corvettes, except the one from 1981 to 1990... that was the worst age for corvettes, I thought it was going to to to a Cavalier level or some shit like that. The ZR1 revived its image, then the C5! then a modified C5, the Z06... good choice GMC!!
Re: The engine made it so expensive. sorry, incorrect. the ZR1 had a Mercury Marine engine. 4 vpc, yes. lotus, no.
Re: The engine made it so expensive. There pushrods were eating shit because of gas prices, they lowered the HP ratings to save up on gas and to sell more cars. HP/L means nothing, it souldnt even be a comparison, its totally pointless and tells you nothing performance wise. Just because the engine has large displacement doesnt mean its a "big" heavy engine. The Z06's LS6 is 2.5 litres larger than the 2004 NSX's 3.2L engine. The LS6 is aslo only 25lbs heavier than it too, just because it is has alot more displacment doesnt mean it heavier. After saying that notice a difference in the weight of this vette compared to other C4s? ?Thats because this "Technologically advanced" DOHC configuration weighs the car down by alot. Thats another reason for using pushrod engines, there light. The Viper is an awsome car, its takes on almost any car in its price range(NSX, Skyline, Vette Ford GT etc.), and the V10 is NOT a truck engine, it originated in the Viper, then they made the sporty Ram to compete with the Lightning so they used the Vipers engine.
Re: The engine made it so expensive. DragStrip hit the nail on the head. DOHC weighs more, and hp/L is meaningless unless you are in a displacement restricted racing series. Pushrods have been working fine since they were developed...years after overhead cams were developed. Who's using the old technology, I wonder? And in that case, since OHC is older, shouldn't it be even cheaper than a pushrod engine? The Viper engine isn't a truck engine per se, but it is essentially an adapted version of the V10 truck engine they had at the time. 1981 to 1990 covers two generations, so how that is the worst age for Corvettes is beyond me. The 1980 to 82 Vettes did suffer, but only due to emissions restrictions. 1984 introduced the new generation, and by 1986 Corvette was sweeping the SCCA Showroom Stock series. Porsches, Nissans, everybody lost, and forced a ban on Corvettes because they were too good. I don't see any Cavaliers doing that. Thus the early C4s were the absolute best by the standards of the day, so don't go comparing them to present day cars. They are formidable vehicles, and the styling is highly underrated. The ZR1 did enhance Corvette's image, but reviving it...I wouldn't go that far. GM wanted to bring focus away from foreign competition by building a car that could take anything, a King of the Hill. The ZR1 was a protection of turf, not a resuscitation. And GM is the conglomerate auto corporation, GMC is a division that makes trucks.
Re: The engine made it so expensive. sorry, my apologies. Lotus designed it and mercury marine built it. we're both right, haha.
Re: The engine made it so expensive. ZR-1's are so sweet, they should use this engine in modern Z06's, it makes the same power and has an cool feature that limits power to all keys but the owners
Re: The engine made it so expensive. Yeah, i love the Zr1, but like the post above say they got rid of the DOHC confrig for many good reasons. If they brought it back it would most likely hinder the perfomance if anything.
Re: The engine made it so expensive. I think that a modern take on the LT5 would keep the performance, but send the price skyhigh (much like the original)
Re: The engine made it so expensive. --- the V10 is NOT a truck engine, it originated in the Viper, then they made the sporty Ram to compete with the Lightning so they used the Vipers engine. --- The Viper's engine originated from a design intended for a truck, then it was slightly modified by Lamborghini - who recast the head in aluminum alloy instead of iron and raised the power output a bit. It has the performance characteristics of a truck engine. It sounds like a truck engine. It was build from a design for a truck engine, in other words, it IS a truck engine. If it walks like a duck, quacks like a duck and eats bread crumbs out of muddy pond water like a duck... chances are, it is a duck.
Re: The engine made it so expensive. --- After saying that notice a difference in the weight of this vette compared to other C4s? ?Thats because this "Technologically advanced" DOHC configuration weighs the car down by alot. Thats another reason for using pushrod engines, there light. --- And yet lots of companies (Noble and TVR to just name two) make sports cars with OHC engines that are lighter and have much better power:weight ratios than any Corvette model Chevy has ever sold to the public. BTW, DOHC engines aren't that much more expensive than pushrod engines if they are manufactured in quantity - they'll add just a few hundred dollars to the cost of the car.
Re: The engine made it so expensive. Wrong, Lambo offered an engine to dodge for the viper, dodge refused for what ever reason, and made their own V10 for the viper. I dont know what vipers you have heard, but they dont sound like trucks.
Re: The engine made it so expensive. Nobel, uses a FORD 3L with turbo, so that doesnt count, and TVRs arnt exaclty "affordable." The LS6 weighs around 400lbs, and producing 400hp, and 400ft-lbs of torque, is one hard engine to beat in power to weight. Why do you think so many track cars have an LS6?
Re: The engine made it so expensive. --- Wrong, Lambo offered an engine to dodge for the viper, dodge refused for what ever reason, and made their own V10 for the viper --- No, actually Chrysler went to Lamborghini for their expertise on sportscar engines and had them modify their truck-engine design by redesigning the head slightly (too bad they didn't give Lambo the time/budget to make it a DOHC) and recasting the block in aluminum instead of iron. --- I dont know what vipers you have heard, but they dont sound like trucks. --- They sure don't sound like sports cars.
Re: The engine made it so expensive. --- Nobel, uses a FORD 3L with turbo, so that doesnt count --- Doesn't count as what? An OHC engine? It is. A car with a better power:weight ratio than a Corvette? It is. --- and TVRs arnt exaclty "affordable." --- Well, they're not cheap if that's what you mean. But compared to Corvettes, they're definitely in the same price bracket. --- The LS6 weighs around 400lbs, and producing 400hp, and 400ft-lbs of torque, is one hard engine to beat in power to weight. --- Hard, but certainly not impossible. --- Why do you think so many track cars have an LS6? --- For the same reason most people own PCs... They make up for their many disadvantages by being cheap, ubiqutous and having many third-party companies with products and expertise related to improving them. But certainly not because they represent the best in either innovation or technology.
Re: The engine made it so expensive. They sound more like sports car than I4s and 6 cylinder engines do.
Re: The engine made it so expensive. The Ford 3L doesnt count being a turbocharged and innercooled engine, comparing it to a NA engine, of course its going to make alot more power, its using forced induciton... Being that TVRs are not sold in america there no where near the price range of a corvette. And in europe the corvette is still much cheaper. You seriously need to stop being so biased, the LS6 is one of the best engines on the market.
Re: The engine made it so expensive. --- They [Viper V-10s] sound more like sports car than I4s and 6 cylinder engines do. --- Hahahahahah, that's pretty funny... or pretty sad depending on whether you were serious. No, the Viper's V-10 sounds exactly like a truck engine put through the exhaust system of a performance car - not too susprising when you consider that's exactly what it is. A sports-car, it isn't. The Viper has always been too heavy to be a proper sports car. p.s. Wanna hear what a real man's V-10 sounds like? Listen to the Lamborghini Gallardo or Porsche GT. As for the sound of an I-4, the Honda S2000's engine sounds pretty good once you get it over 7000 revs. Porsche made a series of excellent and very butch-sounding I-4s. And don't even start ragging on I-6s... All the best sports-car engines in the world have been either I-6 or their close-relative the V-12. Jaguar, Aston Martin, TVR, Ferrari, Lamborghini, BMW, etc... to name just a few. The three best sounding engines in the world, bar none: 1. The Aston-Martin V-12 as heard in the Vanquish and DB9. Tadek Merak's legendary 5.3 liter V-8 from the 1970s cars was great but the Cosworth V-12 is sublime. 2. The TVR Speed Six engine (4.0 liter version) as heard in the Cerbera and Tuscan. Blipping the throttle on one of these is the closest thing to sex you'll have with your fly zipped. 3. Lamborghini V-12 (ANY version). The engine has grown in displacement since its introduction in the 1960s and is fed by EFI now instead of carbueration but it still sounds as balls-out as ever unlike Ferrari's engines which sound a bit nasal with the electronic fuel systems.
Re: The engine made it so expensive. --- The Ford 3L doesnt count being a turbocharged and innercooled engine, comparing it to a NA engine, of course its going to make alot more power, its using forced induciton... --- So what? We weren't talking about power, we were talking about weight and the claim that OHC engines are automatically heavier than OHV engine is nonsense. --- Being that TVRs are not sold in america there no where near the price range of a corvette. --- Comparing apples and oranges again, I see... Where TVRs are sold doesn't affect the price. BTW, TVRs start new at around £38,000 (TVR Tamora, out the door price including air-con) which, if the dollar was as healthy as it should be, would equate to around $48,000. What's the base sticker price for a Corvette? Around $51,000... Sounds like the same price range to me. --- And in europe the corvette is still much cheaper. --- No, actually, it isn't. By the time you factor in the import costs (the Corvette isn't officially sold in the UK or Europe), add about $20,000 to the cost of the car. --- You seriously need to stop being so biased, the LS6 is one of the best engines on the market. --- Based on what? BTW, why do you think Chevy went to Lotus to design them an engine when they wanted to update the Corvette's mill? Because they knew when it came to building modern, high-performance OHC engines, they didn't have the expertise. Seriously, as I said before, LS6 engines are like PCs, they aren't great in any way but they get the job done, they're mass-produced so you can get service, support and upgrade almost anywhere and that's a big thing for most people who buy them.
Re: The engine made it so expensive. Well being that most 4 cylinders sound like broken weed wakers, or wet farts, and alot of 6 cylinders sound like louder farts, the V10 sounds very nice. Does this sound like a truck? http://www.dodge-vipers.com/videos/srt10qtr.mpeg If you say yes, which you probably will because your so biased, than you hear some pretty nice sounding trucks. Sorry but the BMW I6 exhaust note is nothing special, my neighbor has a 3 series, and it doesnt sound powerful, or even close to being a sports car. Now the viper is not a sports car because its "heavy"? Do you consider a Supra a sports car, it weighs 3450lbs, and the viper srt-10 weighs 3380lbs, its only about 100lbs heavier than an Enzo, jag XJ220, and its lighter than the Murcielago. Weight does not determine a sports car, a sports car is simply RWD, has IRS, 2 seats and is made to be a sports car. The weight doesnt make it not a sports car, thats rediculous.
Re: The engine made it so expensive. The vette in america starts at $42,000 and that includes power everything, AC, CD player, traction control, active handling program, and alot more goodies. That translates to about £35,203 and btw that is the price of it in europe according to EVO magazine. Like i said you are biased, you dont look your information up and you assume that the american cars are always inferior to the other brands. Chevy went to lotus because on their current engine they could not have the compression ratio above 9:1 for emission reasons. Then when they brought back the LT1 it was quite a hit, and produced alot of underrated power. Sorry to break it to you but the LS6 is an increadable engine, and im sorry you to blind by your ignorance to relize this. Can you name another engine that make that much power and torque, and get as good fuel economy and reliabiliy?
Re: The engine made it so expensive. --- Well being that most 4 cylinders sound like broken weed wakers, or wet farts --- Not all four-cylinder powered cars sound like a Hyundai. Honda S2000 for one, Any four-cylinder Lotus Esprit for another. Hell, even the Fiat Pininfarina spyder from the 80s or the Jensen Healey roadster from the 1970s (though, to be fair, it used the engine that Lotus later put in the Esprit) sounded awesome. --- Does this sound like a truck? --- Actually, yes it does. And I'm not the only one who thinks so. As I said before, the Viper sounds like a truck with a sports exhaust. The reason for that is because the engine in the Viper was originally designed for a truck before it was modified by Lamborghini for use in a muscle car. Like I said before, you want to hear what a real performance-car V-10 sounds like? Listen to the Gallardo or Carrera GT. --- Sorry but the BMW I6 exhaust note is nothing special, my neighbor has a 3 series, and it doesnt sound powerful, or even close to being a sports car. --- Blame the exhuast. The straight-six sound is inherently brilliant. However, BMW design their exhausts for sound-deadening (except for maybe the M-series cars). The V-12 powered 750 and 850 sounded pretty unremarkable too and everyone knows that V-12s make the best noise of all. --- Now the viper is not a sports car because its "heavy"? Do you consider a Supra a sports car --- That's right, the Viper is too heavy to be considered a proper sports car. It is a "muscle car". The handling is far from brilliant as well. But then that's not surprising, no American car has ever been renowned for its handling - except perhaps compared to other American cars. I don't consider the Supra a sports-car either - it is a mini-GT. --- the viper srt-10 weighs 3380lbs, its only about 100lbs heavier than an Enzo, jag XJ220, and its lighter than the Murcielago --- Actually, the Enzo weighs 3020lbs/1370kg so that's a 300lb difference - unless you're using the "new math". 1370kg is still heavy for a sports car but the 660bhp from the engine help to counterbalance that. The Jaguar XJ220 was never meant to be a sports-car. It is HUGE. It is almost two feet longer than the already massive Viper and a foot wider. Yet, it still weighs about 100lbs less than the Viper. The Murcielago is a GT as well. Lamborghini don't make "sports cars" and they never have. THe Murc's 4WD system will always have it at a weight-disadvantage compared to 2WD cars but means that you can use more of the performance more of the time in the real world. --- Weight does not determine a sports car, a sports car is simply RWD, has IRS, 2 seats and is made to be a sports car. The weight doesnt make it not a sports car, thats rediculous. --- Not ridiculous at all. Weight is one of the primary considerations of a sports car and always has been since Colin Chapman started leading the way. Excess weight is anathema to the sports car. It blunts acceleration, ruins handling, decreases cornering grip and braking... The list goes on. What you describe above is a muscle-car which is, in reality, the crude American interpretation of the GT. e.g. Viper/Corvette/Mustang.
Re: The engine made it so expensive. --- The vette in america starts at $42,000 and that includes power everything, AC, CD player, traction control, active handling program, and alot more goodies. That translates to about £35,203 and btw that is the price of it in europe according to EVO magazine. --- I don't have the latest copy of EVO in front of me so I can't check but the Corvette dealers I've seen charge a lot more for them that that. Still, even if you're right, that puts it firmly in the price range of TVRs. BTW, the reason the Corvette offers band-aid fixes to bad design like traction-control and active-handling and ABS is because it has to. Real sports cars don't need these things. --- Sorry to break it to you but the LS6 is an increadable engine --- Only in comparison to other Detroit engines and then not even that. Ford makes better engines than Chevy anyway. --- Can you name another engine that make that much power and torque, and get as good fuel economy and reliabiliy? --- Sure, lots of them. For power, you can choose from lots of engines. All the major German manufacturers (Mercedes, BMW, Porsche, Audi, VW) make engines at least as powerful as the LS6. Most British manufacturers do too... Aston Martin, Jaguar and TVR. Even Noble is now nudging the 400bhp barrier. And I don't know why people keep harping on the vette's fuel economy, it is a myth. The EPA numbers are nonsense. In reality, the vette will return mileage in the teens and while that isn't awful, it isn't exactly something to brag about. Turbocharged engines (e.g. Porsche, Audi, etc.) of equivalent power to n.a. engines are always going to be more fuel-efficient even though they have other disadvantages. Reliability? Detroit hasn't got a lot to brag about here either. The only reason they're still not making disposable (i.e. good for around 60,000 miles before they fall apart) cars like they did for more than two decades starting in the late 1960s is because the Japanese and the Germans forced them to. Hell, even Jaguar has been making reliable cars longer than Detroit has. The really ironic thing is that the manufacturing processes now in use all over the world were invented by an American who took them to Detroit only to have the Big Three slam their collective doors in his face. Face it: the LS6, while Chevy may be very proud of it, isn't anything special when you look at what the rest of the world is doing and don't merely focus on Detroit.
Re: The engine made it so expensive. Sorry to break it to you but Honda is exacly what i was talking about. They have the absolute worst exhaust notes ive ever heard. Ive heard many S2000, and if i were to close my eyes i would think i was a high winding weed waker. From what you have said i can tell you have never heard a viper in real life, they sound alot like ferraris or lamborghinis, nothing like trucks. You truly are the typical european, weight does not make a sports car, like i said before thats rediculas. Muscle cars have solid rear axles, as i hope you know is better for accleration and worse for cornering. You have to remember that not every company can make and sell a super light weight car. They have to work with what they have. As far as handing goes the vette and viper hold over 1g on the skid pad, and run faster than 70mph on the slalom. The Corvette is known for its handling, and the viper is more or less known for its top speed. And even if the corvette and viper were muscle cars, its pretty sad that they are beating sports cars and GTs over 2X the price.
Re: The engine made it so expensive. I looked it up on the net. You are truly so blinded by your own ignornace. These so called "band-aid" fixes are for real world driving. You have to remember people drive these cars on the street to. Traction control comes in handy when your driving in the rain/snow, and active handeling is simply for sharp quick turns without spinning out. Try dodging a pot hole in your little elise, then spin out and crash. If you had active handling it wouldnt have happened... My god child, get out of your fantasy world, my neighbor has a 99 corvette, and it gets every bit of 19/28mpg under normal driving conditions. All the engines you listed are alot heavier, and less efficient than the LS6 BTW... And that same 99 next door to me has 110,000miles on it without anything gone wrong or replaced(daily driver). I can go on about reliabilty, it far excedes european engines, ive seen so many LS1s and LT1s with over 150,000miles on them and absolutly nothing wrong. That same BMW 3 series on the other hand(the one that sounds like shit) only lasted until 90,000miles before the engine was shot. You have just proven to know absolutly nothing about american manufacturers, or even your own european manufacturers. Go do some resarch, and get into reality.
Re: The engine made it so expensive. --- Sorry to break it to you but Honda is exacly what i was talking about. They have the absolute worst exhaust notes ive ever heard. Ive heard many S2000, and if i were to close my eyes i would think i was a high winding weed waker. From what you have said i can tell you have never heard a viper in real life, they sound alot like ferraris or lamborghinis, nothing like trucks. --- Nonsense. The S2000s exhaust note isn't the best four-pot in history but it is pretty good. Granted the Lotus and Pininfarina Spider's are better but the Honda is still good. Only a tone-deaf fool would mistake a Viper for a Ferrari or Lamborghini. --- You truly are the typical european --- Actually, I'm an American. Born and raised in the US. The difference between us is that I've actually been outside the country. --- weight does not make a sports car --- Then you don't understand the meaning of the term "sports car". --- Muscle cars have solid rear axles --- Are there a lot of Vipers and Corvettes with solid rear axles? I didn't think so. --- You have to remember that not every company can make and sell a super light weight car. --- You're right, some companies just don't have the skill. --- As far as handing goes the vette and viper hold over 1g on the skid pad --- Like most apologists for American cars, you confuse grip with handling. Handling isn't about grip, it is about how the car behaves when the grip gives out. --- The Corvette is known for its handling --- ROTFLMAO!! I actually think you might be serious. That's pretty sad. The only handling the Corvette is known for is terrible handling.