This Car only makes 180 HP

Discussion in '2002 Mazda RX-8' started by FerrariENZO, Sep 8, 2003.

  1. Re: This Car only makes 180 HP

    Oy,

    Obviously none of you have DRIVEN a new RX-8. I can say with complete confidence that it feels like 1,000 horsepower when it's banging around some back road. Obviously you must keep it in its power range, which can be difficult, but it is a remarkable car... and I hate my friend now because he has one and I don't.

    I can't attest to anything besides what I read in the aforementioned issue of Sport Compact Car. Auto companies love feeding people lines, and I have a feeling Mazda is doing exactly that with the “smart” engine. Is the car losing over 40 horses in the drive train? Seriously doubtful, but I would wager that the current claim of around 230 horse is accurate. I am curious about the torque claims though. I have driven Ford Focuses (Foci?) that seem to have more torque. I await aftermarket goodies with bated breath.

    On the subject of Rotary reliability, Rotary engines kept blowing because they were turbo charged in the 7. That generated an absolutely silly amount of heat which had a nasty tendency of blowing O rings and gaskets. If you kept the engine up well and didn't hot-dog the car on a regular basis though, the engine’s fine.
     
  2. Re: This Car only makes 180 HP

    I drive one moron. The only one in this messed up board.
    And it doesnt feel like 1000hp, it it did, it would drive like shit. It feels like it weighs 1000pounds and has 300hp. Its nimble and very fast if you keep it between 7-10k revs.
    And the new 238hp claim is right. I believe it. At the track the RX8 can outhandle an M3 and outaccelerate an WRX in the lower speeds. The only negative point I can think of is the absolutely torqueless 1-5k rpm range. When in 2nd gear and at about 4k rpm and you pull out hard it goes very slow, you need to wait till about 6krpm or change gears to 1st, and then it catapults again, but theres a chance of spinning when having esp off.
    It has 220NM at 7000RPM. Wich is not much, but you also have to think of the very strong high RPM range it has above those 7K rpm. Also rotary engines give another poweroutput than piston engines. 200hp piston is about 170hp rotary. So the 238hp of the RX8 is almost equil to 280-300hp piston, only you have to rev it alot more. I love driving it, only its for sale now again, wich I think is ashame, I would drive it my whole life if it was possible.
     
  3. Re: This Car only makes 180 HP

    Pics of ŽmyŽ RX8 and RX7.
     
  4. Re: This Car only makes 180 HP

    Calm yourself there, bucky.

    I used 1,000 horsepower as a figure of speech. Obviously, you took me literally for lord knows what reason. Next time I shall climb the ladder of absurdity even higher to 1,000,000 just to make sure everyone knows I'm being figurative.
     
  5. #30 LocoMC, Jan 4, 2004
    Last edited by a moderator: Apr 25, 2016
    Re: This Car only makes 180 HP

    I.A,

    238 Horsepower from a rotary engine is exactly the same as 238 Horsepower from a piston engine. Horsepower is a measurement of work. It doesn't matter what DOES that work, only that the work has been done. If anyone wants a longer explanation, go to www.howstuffworks.com and read up on horsepower. It's really interesting.
     
  6. Re: This Car only makes 180 HP

    No, you said it literally. And why did you even mention Hps? It has nothing to do with handling of the suspension.

    And I know rotary Hps are delivered different to the wheel than piston hps. Its more solid.
     
  7. Re: This Car only makes 180 HP

    100hp to the wheels is (roughly (depends on the manufacturer)) 100kw to the flywheel. So if the manufacturer's claim is 250hp, they (usually) mean to the flywheel. divide the claim by 1.337 and that's the number you should expect to come up on a dyno. If they say 250hp, the rwhp is claimed to be around 187hp. I'm sure once the rotors are worn in, it'll meet the claimed power on the dyno.
    This isnt from my imagination. I read it in 'Street Machine' (a famous Australian muscle car magazine that my dad and i have collected since 1987. It has become my Bible).
     
  8. Re: This Car only makes 180 HP

    What do you mean by more solid?

    I'm willing to go with you on this, but I need a better explanation than that.
     
  9. Re: This Car only makes 180 HP

    I.A

    I mentioned horsepower because that is what this thread is about. At least... I think it is. *Looks around nervously*... Mom?
     
  10. Re: This Car only makes 180 HP

    The dual rotors have both 2 combustion rooms. Each rotor is equil to lets say four cilinders, cause of the two combustion rooms and it goes round instead of up and down where you have only one workstroke.
    2 times 4 is 8, like 8 cilinders. The circular movement of the rotor means it has waaay less resistant than a pistonengine, where the up and down movement with more compression means alot more friction and also vibrations. If you gas with an wankel you have a very smooth powergift, like an inline eight. If you gas with lets say an V6 its not as smooth due to its strokeforce and individual forcestroke. Also if you loose the gas in the RX8 it brakes alot less on the engine than with a pistonengine, reminds you of the low friction. Its just one smooth line with the poweroutput, where you have a big flywheel in a pistonengine to compensate the forcestrokes with the dead strokes, you'll always have vibrations and a less smooth poweroutput.

    Maybe this is a chaos, because I typed it all after eachother, but i hope it makes sense.
     
  11. Re: This Car only makes 180 HP

    Well yes,

    All that is correct, but that has no bearing on the quality or "solidity" of the horsepower measurement. All those engine characteristics allow for more horsepower from smaller displacement. It's those remarkable numbers that allow the engine to put out what is basically equivalent to the S2000's engine with .7 fewer liters. A horse is a horse... of course of course and I'm not going any further with that joke.
     
  12. Re: This Car only makes 180 HP

    Ok, If you're talkin bout horses, every engine puts the same measure in horses, but I'm only saying that with the Wankel the poweroutput is alot smoother and in one line.
     
  13. Re: reliability of rotary?

    The original Mazda rotary engines were made in 76 I believe. The main problem is the seals going bad in the engine early, a friend of mine bought one new and had to replace them after 30,000. Also, increased wear on the points of the rotor. Mazda uses an oil injector to help overcome this but it does burn a little bit of oil. Because of that I guess your not suppose to use synthetic in it? The motor also overlaps its intake and exhaust "cycles" (not really cycles) also causing the motor to be rather polluting. When the gas is ignited, it is not fully compressed causing the motor to not to be as efficient as a piston. Despite the drawbacks, it has fewer moving parts than a piston engine thus fewer mechanical problems are possible. The new Renesis engine overcomes some of the overlapping by placing the intake and exhaust valves in different positions. 0-60 in 5.9, a top speed of 150mph, and a 1/4 mile in 14.5 means it isn't a bad buy for being stock and under 200 horses. The 18 alloy rims, a 6-speed tranny and a base price of 26,680 gives me a really big hard on. Although the engine noise is a little concerning…..”huuum”(for those who don’t know about the old Mazda commercial) If I get one, I might just punch a few holes in the exhaust pipe and make myself a musical instrument. I think this would make a great car soon as I get out of college. I hope some one finds this helpful or at least amusing. Peace
     
  14. Re: This Car only makes 180 HP

    Why are you posting the same thing in two or more threads?
     
  15. Re: This Car only makes 180 HP

    Actually,

    I'm looking at the dyno sheet produced for Sport Compact Car's article on the RX-8's actual power, and the power is just as peaky as the S2000. It fact it has strange dips in power at 4,000, 6,400, and 7,500 RPM.

    Considering the nature of the article and how Mazda says the RX-8 was going into "Don't overheat the cat mode" these rather bizzare dips can be explained away, but it does give a general map of what a dyno-sheet run on the street would say.

    When you take into consideration their G-Tech runs, even the G-Tech shows those same dips in power, albeit not to the extent shown on the dyno, at similar RPMs.

    In the end, I think the thing that amazes me the most with the Renesis is that it's producing MORE torque than the S2000 with a much smaller engine. Usually the realm of torque is limited to just displacement (Blowers not withstanding.) Well Mazda proved me wrong.
     
  16. Re: This Car only makes 180 HP

    I know its as peaky as the S2000, but that isnt srange, considering the high power output from that small engine. And those dips...mmm I dont feel them when driving really.

    Yes, the Mazda does more torque than the S2000 with a way smaller engine, but the Wankel engines always make more power and torque with low cc's. It isnt that strange really.
     
  17. Re: This Car only makes 180 HP

    "Strange" is something of a relative term.

    I say the torque advantage is strange from the perspective that all engines are basically the same thing. They create rotational power by burning dead dinosaurs inside of an enclosed space. And the usable energy created by that grows with the amount of dead dinosaur that's burning. To increase that amount beyond what is physically possible of a certain space, you have to ad a blower. Or you can just increase the size of the engine.

    That's why I find it interesting that the Renesis produces more torque. I can only assume it has to do with the point at which the burn happens, and the limitations of rotational diameters on the crank in an average piston engine.

    Even with that, those dips in power are strange. If you're not feeling them on the street, it must be an artifact of the dyno. Those dips are large enough where there would be no mistaking them while driving.
     
  18. #43 AlexTVR, Jan 17, 2004
    Last edited by a moderator: Apr 25, 2016
    Re:

    (FUTHER QUOTE):

    "No Other People Can Make This Statement

    In spite of the common stereotypes of mafia and other less desireable characters, fictional or real, the Italians and the Sicilians have contributed more to this planet than any other ethic group. More Italians fought and died for the US efforts during World War II, than any other nationality. The United States was discovered by an Italian (Christoforo Colombo) and named for another (Amerigo Vespucci)."

    Firstly, I would like to refer you all to Top Gears test of the RX8 (available at http://www.geocities.com/turbolimo/main.htm) Jeremy Clarkson (if you don't know who that is, your missing out - a very witty and insightfull car journo) states that this is an amazing package, and this car set a lap time around the specially designed track equal to that of a BMW M3 and the Nissan 350Z - very respectable indeed! All this from a 1.3 litre engine is remarkable, and the package is made even more appealing by the relatively low price and the clever incorporation of relatively spacious back seats for this class of vehicle.

    Secondly, I would like to respond to your 'signature' (quoted above)... You might like to alter it slightly, since you state that the italians and sicilians have contributed more to this PLANET than any other ethnic group and then go on to mention that they helped the US, and found and named the US. The planet does not consist solely of the US.. I would also like to point out that the united states was already inhabited when colombus 'Discovered' it, it had already been visited by the Vikings, and most importantly, if we are talking about great things done for this PLANET, then we might look more importantly at things like the discovery of penicilin, the wheel, fire etc. but even this is only from a human beings point of view....
    ....Anyway, to summarise, your signature is not very smart.
     
  19. Re: This Car only makes 180 HP

    yes the automatic version of the RX-8 has 180 hp. but the 6 speed version has 238 hp exactly, I drove it and it will do every bit of that, I'm the former owner of a 1998 chevy camaro Z28, and i'm here to tell you the RX-8 is much more refined and forgiving in the suspension but is just as much fun to drive, if not more@!
     
  20. Re: This Car only makes 180 HP

    I also have to second your opinion, after driving an RX-8 and owning one soon, it was simply breathtaking to be sitting in this brilliant car thats naturally aspirated and it very comfortable aswell. Thus making this car very refined and luxurious as well as pleasurable to drive.
     
  21. Re: This Car only makes 180 HP

    I was wondering if anyonec an help me. I'm new to the modification scene and I don't know much about modifications can someone help me, with what to upgrade if I wanted to push my RX-8 to about 280Hp and to have good handling to compliment it? I'm having a hard time understanding and trying to find out what happens if I change certain parts and how it affects the performance of the car. And do parts such as spoilers or side skirts or any aesthetically pleasing parts affect the performance of the car?
     
  22. Re: This Car only makes 180 HP

    I bet it can handle 280hp at 10k rev.
     
  23. Re: This Car only makes 180 HP

    Would there be any damage to the engine if you actually went to 10K RPM? Plus my RX-8 ain't manual it's an activematic.
     
  24. Re: This Car only makes 180 HP

    You own an RX-8? I drove one for several months.
    And reving it to 10k isnt that great ffcourse, but it can be done, just dont do it with a cold engine and be sure it has enough oil and doesnt use alot of oil, else there's something wrong.
     
  25. Re: This Car only makes 180 HP

    In my opinion you should wait before making any modifications on this car. it is true that it's heritage isn't the best it could be. Rx-7 wasn't so reliable. I think though mazda has done something about it in the Rx-8. Not many people know a lot about this engine though. So If I were you I would stick to minor mods such as replacing the exhaust system and the airfilter. These mods can easily give something to your Rx-8 and isn't going to produce problems I think. Wait a little for people to learn about this engine and then proceed. Be careful everything you do should be approved by Mazda. After all going to 250bhp from 231 it already produces with the mods I wrote above think is enough for this car. I don't think anyone can say that the car is slow even as it is now.
     

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