Re: m-5 or HSV

Discussion in '2001 HSV VX2 SV300' started by Aych Es Vee, Aug 9, 2002.

  1. motor mag got times for them around the ring, and the hsv came out on top. they had mark skaife and two other guys testing them, one of them a veteran of the ring. can anyone show me times around the ring for the m5.
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  2. How do you know that the mag got time when you ask for it??? I read the mag long ago, and I don't remember any figure on that... If I read it, it must have stick in mind, at least I must have remembered reading it somewhere...

    In case you ask me to dig the mag, I never keep old Aussie mags...<!-- Signature -->
     
  3. Simple, HSV all the way. My reasoning? With the BMW M5 there is no sense of occasion. It only feels special at 9 or 10/10ths. The HSV gives you that sense of occasion. It has pure appeal. Nothing in its class can beat it for pure visceral lust.
     
  4. couldntve said it better. the m5 looks to plain but the hsv stands out and gets people looking. They sound great to. pepole really bag te quality of the commodore but it is pretty good and is not 50grand worse than the bmw
    also since the article about the ring the hsv has recorded faster times, now got a nicer interior, much better brakes (they were already very good) and better low down torque
     
  5. the HSV stands out as it is one of the only cars that comes ryced out with non - functioning aero package, and in my eyes looks pathetic. the M5 is all class and subtle agression. look in any style guide, you see the chicks draped over german and italian cars, not austrlian.
    the M5 is hit hard by local taxes, it would be almost lineball in price if not for import duties. then which car would you prefer?
     
  6. agreed. it hits something like 70%-90% tariffs coming into australia. mightily evil.
     
  7. the aero package actually does work.
    and imported cars are not hit with tarrifs that much at all any more, even with no tarrifs the m5 would still be a lot more expensive than the gts. and i would take the gts any day
     
  8. how does it work? does it provide any meaningful downforce? the wing is far too small to do that, it probably isn't even high enough to get out of the slipstream of the cabin

    O/S cars not getting hit with tariffs? well then why does a 90 grand BMW 330i cost about 45 grand in any european country? before you say shipping, the aussie ones are made in south africa were shipping would only be about 3 or so grand to australia

    and why does the M5 in question list for about 60 000 pounds in britain (approx 150 grand) or 70 grand us in america (about 120 grand aussie)

    120 grand isnt much more than 100 grand

    and why would you take the GTS any day? would you care to provide us with a reason? i don't think thats too much to ask
     
  9. The M5 is AUD $200,000.
    Increasing luxury car tax and tariffs the price is increased by 72%.
    So roughly it works out to be available at AUD $115,000.
    Pretty good considering Holden wants $100,000 for a tweaked $22,000 executive with a big V8.
     
  10. well its not looking good for the idiot holden supporters out there
     
  11. I'm not sure about the downforce supposedly provided by the HSV's however I have read comments in mags like Wheels and Motor where they have said things like the HSV's don't "get the wanders" as much as SS's at high speed.
     
  12. The GTS being a $100K tweaked executive is no no different from the M5 being a $200K tweaked 530i...
     
  13. So because I like a car that you have found a competitor for that does a few things better, I am an idiot?
     
  14. no your alright...just some Holden supporters seem to be running a bit low on intelligence
     
  15. Agreed, only difference is the 530i roles out as a luxury sedan not a bottom of the range family car.
    530i offers safety, 50-50 weight distribution and more.
    The executive is just a family car.

    This is probably why the M5 turns out as a better overall package, because it's based on a great car to start off with.
     
  16. Yeah it does role out as a luxury sedan...but that is just because they have given lots of equipment to their base model compared to Holden. BMW could make a commodore-like equipped 5 series or vice versa, but it still wouldn't really change the roots of the car would it?
     
  17. The only difference is that the base car for the M5 (530i) costs about the same as the tweaked version. (maybe 25% less)

    Where as the Exec is about 75% cheaper than its tweaked counterpart, therefore, it isn't saying the same thing now is it

    25% difference between the two BMW's or 75% difference between the two Holdens. Hmmm... yeah, thats close now isn't it.

    An expensive car based on a cheap car is always going to be a cheap car with more stuff. But an expensive car based on an equally expensive car is still going to be an expensive car with more stuff. But what can you get in the M5 that you can't get optioned in the 5 series, not much.
     
  18. thank you, that was what i was trying to say. Motor have also said the top speed on the hsv's is as high as they are partly because of the bodykit creating less drag.

    and with the tarrifs, teh aussie government last year gave the local car manufacturers over a billion dollars because they will be (and already have) significantly lowered the tarrifs on imported cars.

    i prefer teh hsv, that doesnt make me an idiot. they are just as fast (debatebly faster), i believe they look better, the m5 looks way to similar to the normal bmw's and the interior on the hsv's is pretty good.
     
  19. Or, the soon to be V10 M5 will be faster, they already look better, based on a $150k car instead of holden being based on a $22k car and holden have yet to prove that "Luxury" is in their vocbulary.
     
  20. A luxury car isn't just extras.
    If you give the executive wood-grain dash, leather seats and a GPS system, sure its options are similar to the 5-series but it’s not a luxury car, it’s an optioned up executive.
    Luxury cars are more than just simple interior options; they comprise of suspension, steering systems, sound-proofing, brakes, springs, electronics (traction control etc.)

    If a 530i roles out with an average dash-layout, fabric seats and a basic 6-speeker sound system; it's still a luxury car, just with less options as it has suspension to give it a smooth ride and all the other peripherals you’d need in a luxury car (bar small interior deficits.)
    Sure you could strip an executive to its shell and start again, but then it is not an executive anymore as you've gotten rid of everything but the shape.

    The 530i, from the day it was just a concept, was designed to be a luxury car. The executive was designed from day one to be a family car that is why no matter what you do to the executive; it will always be an optioned up executive and nothing more.
     
  21. For one, the Australian government lower the tariffs, not the local car manufacturers.
    It doesn't matter anyway because by giving the firms the money and lowering tariffs they both simultaneously cancel each other out because Holden can now charge less for there cars instead of Mercedes being forced to charge more - so the overall net effect is zero in terms of tariff reduction.
     
  22. That still might swing some buyers...those who may want to purchase a foreign car that couldn't previously afford it, may do it, even though local cars are cheaper.
     
  23. "Luxury cars are more than just simple interior options; they comprise of suspension, steering systems, sound-proofing, brakes, springs, electronics (traction control etc.) "

    That is true, however Holdens do have most of those things, some to a lesser level. But whether or not they do have them or how good they are doesn't mean that it can't be a luxury car.

    "If a 530i roles out with an average dash-layout, fabric seats and a basic 6-speeker sound system; it's still a luxury car, just with less options as it has suspension to give it a smooth ride and all the other peripherals you’d need in a luxury car (bar small interior deficits.)"

    Again very true but, but the Executive also has most of those things, just at a different level (ride im talking about in particular), and just because it might not be as good doesn't really make it any lesser of a luxury car.

    I think the 530i and the Executive aren't vehciles built for totally different purposes as you say (family/luxury). I think they both go out to achieve similar things
    (ie best performance/ride/safety/handling/braking they can achieve) however the base Holdens just have less features.
     
  24. Mainly they are two different cars for two different markets...

    the petrol is expensive and the roads are crowded and the distances are short in Europe, so the 3 series is BMW's commodore equivalent and the 5 would be the equivalent of a Statesman
     
  25. they both set out to do the same thing, yes, but BMW just do it much better.
     

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