Russia and the US election

Discussion in 'General Chat' started by SEABEE, Dec 28, 2016.

  1. https://www.washingtonpost.com/worl...6616a33048d_story.html?utm_term=.6e3d019f5e59

    http://www.cnn.com/2016/12/12/politics/russian-hack-donald-trump-2016-election/
    Updated 7:50 AM ET, Fri December 16, 2016
    What does the US believe Russia did to interfere in the 2016 campaign?
    The US government publicly announced in October that it was "confident" Russia orchestrated the hacking of the Democratic National Committee and other political organizations of the Democratic Party.
    Those hacks resulted in the public release of thousands of stolen emails, many of which included damaging revelations about the Democratic Party and former Secretary of State Hillary Clinton, the party's nominee.
    But intelligence agencies didn't go as far as suggesting the efforts were aimed at bolstering Trump's chances and hurting Clinton's. Then, earlier this month, the CIA announced to a group of top US senators its latest finding: that Russia's hacks were aimed at helping Trump.

    So what changed?
    The CIA's new conclusion was based on its latest and most complete analysis of intelligence on the hacking, including the finding that Russian hackers breached GOP individuals and organizations prior to the election, including Republican House members, thought leaders and non-profits to the GOP, a former senior law enforcement official with direct knowledge of the hack investigation told CNN.
    There is also evidence that entities connected to the Russian government were bankrolling "troll farms" that spread fake news about Clinton. Investigators also found digital footprints of individuals tied to the Russian government who had been on intelligence agencies radar before, as was acknowledged when the intelligence agency put out a public statement in October.
    Republican National Committee officials have repeatedly denied that their systems were breached, insisting instead that only individual staffers' accounts were hacked.
    The US intelligence community writ large is increasingly confident the Russian hacks were aimed at helping Trump, but the 17-agency intelligence community has not officially drawn that conclusion.



    So the govt seems pretty convinced that Russia engaged in state sponsored cyberattacks with the goal of manipulating the US election. Obama seems pissed

    what do you guys think? I used to be of the mind that they did us a favor exposing DNC corruption, and I still kind of feel this way, but they exposed info in such a way as to spin a narrative and prop up President Elect Donald Trump of the Apprentice.

    political implications?

    why dont republicans care? i know, of course they are happy because they won, but since when are we excited to be molested by those red bastards?

    the internet seems like a pretty brand new battlefield that it seems like nobody is really prepared for.

    also doesnt it seem like cyber attacks would be a pretty effective way of hurting civilians if utilities/economic targets and such could be breached?
     
  2. Seems like a lot of republicans not directly affiliated with trump are calling for deeper investigation. Trump himself denies the allegations against our Comrades, which makes more sense.
     
  3. I think democrats are just butthurt and try to look for an excuse.

    Normally i would vote for a democrat, but this time i don't want to be associated with these butthurt milenials/sjw's
     
    F50Fanatic and ETB4U like this.
  4. by democrats do you mean the CIA? what reason would they have to falsify findings?

    also I remember vanilla ice basically warning against this situation months ago before the election had finished. Back then I was very happy to see clinton and the DNCs grossness put on display. But he saw the deeper implications!
     
  5. Well yeah. Ask Iran.

    If countries, such as USA/China really wanted to, they could totally **** up a small developed country by cyber attacks alone.
     
  6. What reason would KGB have to falsify findings!

    I'd imagine that most of the CIA staff generally vote republican tho.
     
  7. Im sure our security is a little bit better, but it seems like cyber security all around is woefully inadequate
    the next big war will probably be very much felt at home, unlike whatever wars we are in right now. All we see are yellow ribbons and guys with ptsd and titanium limbs. No sense of being in a conflict at all. Im getting through that Tribe book and he talks about how the veterans have issues coming back to a society that doesnt know shit about war. Its not like WWII where the whole country basically became a war machine even if you werent in trenches.
    it leads to the lack of unity that can be felt today
     
  8. id imagine they want to be seen as competent at their work as well. when asked to assess a breach by a foreign agent Id like to think they could throw party affiliations aside
    but i probably have a naive image of the cia. after all they are just a govt agency. When we get a good look into the workings of these agencies we are rarely impressed.
     
  9. Lmao it wasn't some elaborate haxx0r plan that got into the DNC. It was a phising expedition.
    http://www.forbes.com/sites/kevinmu...revent-it-from-happening-to-you/#72db3c4f5c02

    And, if a thief steals a laptop and turns it into the police because it had child porn, I'm going to worry more about the child porn. At what point do you ignore the evil shit Clinton did just because 'rabble rabble' commies did it? Also, the Russians were nice enough to donate millions to the Clintons.
    To say it was solely to help Trump is pretty presumptuous. Did they ask the hackers? Perhaps trump/RNC was more secure.
    I'd be more worried about our own DHS trying to infiltrate the actual voting machines.
    https://www.google.com/amp/www.pcwo...raced-an-attempted-voter-hack-to-dhs.amp.html
     
  10. I'm just afraid that this is a distraction that will prevent the DNC folks from receiving the full brunt of ire that they deserve for all the garbage they were into. We should be 100% pissed at the DNC for being pricks, we should be 100% pissed at Russia for being Russia again, but neither should take away from the other. Alas, the American public these days only has so many fucks to give, so the DNC will probably "get away with it" relatively moreso than if the Russia business didn't come out.


    TLDR: Yeah the method by which we have this info about the DNC is bad and needs addressed, but nevertheless the DNC definitely are dicks and deserve our full attention.
     
    SEABEE likes this.
  11. There's some reason to suspect there's a schism in the US political system. Some people believe the factions roughly consist of Democrats, the neocon republican faction and the CIA on one side. The FBI, US military, NSA and Trump republicans on the other.

    Before Trump the Bushes and neocons had tight control over the republican party so the FBI and Military faction had no way to object. Now that they have a political force on their side things appear to be unraveling, the US military has become quite fond of bombing Syrian rebels known to be supplied by the CIA.

    It's unclear what they are fighting over or why the neocon-CIA faction appears nervous and hyping up Russia. If I had to guess they are more deeply implicated in the Arab spring, ISIS and other Islamic militant groups than is known. Most of the politicians on the Democrat and neocon side have deep links to the Saudi monarchy and other gulf states. While McCain personally flew to Syria to take selfies with ISIS leadership before they were ISIS. There's always rumors of the CIA generating cash via drugs to keep things hidden from regulators. Tougher US/mexico border enforcement may be an issue for them.
     
  12. Nothing but propaganda, and may be a away to delegitimize the election (most free and fair in a very long time). No proof or sources have been made public.
     
    ETB4U likes this.
  13. Regardless of genuine hacking or butthurt propaganda, people will think it is yet another butthurt excuse, especially after the humiliation with the recount fiasco.
     
  14. She blames everyone / everything but herself for her defeat, ranging from FBI to racism to President Obama to negative press coverage to rigged election. If she didn't act this way after the election then people might actually believe the story with the Russians.

    I wonder what would people's reaction be if Gore or Kerry or McCain or Romney acted the way she did after losing the election.
     
  15. Correction; is should have said voter database, not machine.
     
  16. #16 HippoCrushEverything, Dec 29, 2016
    Last edited: Dec 29, 2016
    Regardless of the nationalistic pathos churned out by Hollywood, none of the wars after the US Civil War was really "felt" at home, at least not in a European/Asian sense. And even that conflict pales in comparison to the impact WW1 had on any of the major initial participants, or the impact WW2 had on the USSR & the defeated nations.

    I'm not trying to undermine the US war effort, or how it changed the course of the war. Simply stating the obvious. Just be grateful that your government played their cards well so you didn't have to deal with a larger number of dead, wounded and permanently fucked in the head. This is also one of the main reasons why the US foreign policy appears overly belligerent/interventionistic to some non-American observers and vice versa.
     
    ETB4U likes this.
  17. We've been dealing with said troll farms for about 10 years now. A reporter even visited one of such buildings in St.Petersburg: http://yle.fi/uutiset/3-7804386

    False news are nothing new, just another tool in the Soviet toolbox of political subversion. It would be naïve to assume that an ex-KGB head of state would simply throw away methods that sometimes were quite effective before and during the Cold War. The only difference is that previously any state could quite effectively control what was written in a newspaper or said in TV news, today it's much more difficult.
     
  18. I think Russia's passive aggressive stance is entertaining.
     
  19. I still tinfoil about the concept that an 'ex' KGB agent was fairly elected as President. From a westerner's view, it would be like blacks voting for an active Klan member.
     
  20. Sometimes I chortle but then I remember that I like having access to water & electricity etc. and I'm all srs again.
     
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  21. #21 F50Fanatic, Dec 29, 2016
    Last edited: Dec 29, 2016
    We can look from a Russian perspective. How much can Russia / Putin gain from Trump being president. Does it give them enough incentive to go through all the trouble of hacking / spreading propaganda.
     
  22. im def mad at the DNC
    i dont know how mad I am at russia. Seems murky
     
  23. what makes you say this?
     
  24. but we're talking about what we think happened
    not what the faceless masses (ie figments of our biased imaginations) think
    do you think russia meddled? if so, what should be done
     
  25. if there is a deal, quite a bit dont you think? im not willing to go there though. For the record, at this time, I do not think donald trump is a direct russian puppet. But he seems very reluctant to seperate his international business interests from his political interests

    Maybe instead of draining the swamp he just wanted to be the biggest monster in the swamp?
    nah he seems like a good guy
     

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